Question on using different key for Pretty woman

[Louis]

I’m sure there’s a lot of hot shot lead guys for this question .The original is a “A” grip , and me being a Barritone 2 Octave Vocalost it’s a bit of a hike to do this number in “A” but I can justify it in D and not butchering it , this is not really a number I want to screw up.( well at least not too badly ha )There’s  a lot going on in this number lead wise and wondering if it can be done in A and sound proper. I seen a clip of him doing it with J Cash in C but we all know Jonny was pretty well in a one octave area and they had to bring it down.My lead guy has his doubts if it will work as we have tried it yet .Louis

[tedtan]

You can play it the same way as you would in A, just capoed at the 5th fret, and you'll be in D (e.g., use the same chord voicings/fingerings, licks, etc.). You could also tune down to D (drop D, Open D, or or standard tuning down a whole step) and play in D, but you'll need to use different chord voicings and, at a minimum, different fingerings for the lead melodies and licks.

Did the other guitarist mention any specific issues with doing the song in D?

[Louis]

I plan on just doing it in D  but it’s him to get that good original sound in D is the question. No Ted we haven’t tried it yet .Umm if he goes way up there to Capo I wonder what the lead is gonna be like ,might lose the original bass sound , don’t know we’d have to try it . Tuning down on stage is pretty well out of the question.

[Edward]

Hey Louis,

Hmmm, we're a trio doing covers and Pretty Woman (EVH style) is on our list ...and we do it in A.  Now I'm not exactly sure what you're asking in the post: that your guitarist's lead lines will work in A?  Maybe I don't get what you're saying because the EVH cover is all OD/chunky rhythm work and no "lead" per se in there (at least that's how we cover it).    Is he comping (or playing single-note lines/fills) behind you as you drive the song?  Sorry, friend, help me out with what I am not understanding here?

Ed

[Louis]

Playing around with it ,I can do it in “A “ i found out today using a different octave, but it’s a shade low .But me using the D grip I have more push . It’s basically for him Ed to play lead in let’s say D instead of “A” is it gonna sound full as the original? We haven’t tried it yet but if he plays lead Capo’ d up on the 5 th fret I wonder how the lead will sound. If I’m gonna do it it has to be done properly or I want no part of it .There’s  one band in town that does it and it’s a total mess .The band I’m in don’t want to do any number outside of the original key and some times it puts in a bit of a fix .What I’m asking ,is will his lead parts will work in “D”and sound real full like the original.

[tedtan]

When you transpose to a higher key, you'll lose some of the lower end of a lower key. Whether this will be enough to no longer sound full to you is something that only you can answer, so you'll have to try it and see. If it doesn't sound full enough, perhaps your bass player can double the lead line to add back some thickness.

I realize that the band wants to play the song in the key Roy performed it in, but losing a bit of low end from transposing is a far better option than performing a song in the wrong key for the singer.

[Edward]

Hey there Louis,

Yeah, I'm gonna go with pretty much exactly what Tedtan said:

- lead singer has to be comfortable with it, so his key choice trumps others in the band. I am always reminding myself that that the audience is 99.836% "regular folks" --i.e. not musicians or tone geeks.  So when they come to hear "music," they're really listening to the singer ...the rest of the players are just support crew

- transposing up or down certainly changes the chord and single-note voicings, to be sure.  This change is fairly straightforward to mitigate with playing elsewhere on the neck, higher or lower, to try and capture (retain?) that timbral flavor from the original key. Whether playing those lead lines in a different position is "enough" for your ears is something you guys all decide during rehearsal ...no substitute for hearing it out, making changes, then deciding to keep/ditch at that juncture.

- the bassist is important here to fill whatever "bottom" you feel may be missing from your lead guy transposing the song.  Doubling up or counter-melody lines go far in this respect.  I play with a pretty tasty bassist who fills the space well ...we're a trio so sounding fuller is a biggie for us.

- playing lead lines capo'd?  No stinkin way I would ever do that!  Unless your lead guy does absolutely no bends, I personally don't think using a capo is a good idea for lead lines for rock covers.  But heck, it's easily likely your guy is bajillion times a better player than I am, so accept that with many grains of salt.

- Hope this doesn't sound silly on my part but what I "hear" you saying is maybe in D it won't sound as "full" as in the orig?  FWIW, we also cover Layla (Eric's "unplugged" version) and we play that in Dm.  That lead line at the end sounds pretty dang good from where I'm a sittin.

Give it a whirl, man!  I have full confidence in your guys making it sound good!!! 

Edward

[Louis]

Yes ,I agree Ted is right . I found my nitch and Pretty Woman is gonna be fine in the original key .Won’t  need the lead Capo’d on the fret fret ha - Wasted days and wasted nights is an other one ,i was doing it in D and they said “no ,got to be in E like the original or it won’t work .Well scrap it then cause I can’t do it in E ,but then trying and trying I found the proper Octave and I can do it in E .On Tues I have a 2 hour set and we’re doing Rambling Man and I have to do it in C , or he wont do it, mind you it’s no problem for me but if I would not be able to the song would be scrapped .  Freakin hard to be a front man cause like you say if the front man is off the rest of the band mean nothing and home they go .

[DO18]

Very interesting read and I am in no way familiar with playing Pretty Woman.  Looking at the chords it is:

A.       F#m
A.       F#m
D.       E.            B5.       E
B5.     E.            B5.       E.     B5.    E

I am asking out of my ignorance hoping to learn something.  Why couldn't it be played:

Capo 2

G.    Em.     
G.    Em
C.    D.        A5.   D
A5.  D.        A5.   D.    A5.  D

Would that give you the key of A and a lower register.  Everyone wins. 

Again, Im asking out of my definite lack of understanding as to what you are trying to accomplish.
Hoping to have an Ah ha moment.

[Guitarsan]

I know this is not what you're asking about, but you realize there's a key change in the bridge in Pretty Woman, right? The original starts in A and goes to C in the bridge.....

[TLAW]

Very interesting read and I am in no way familiar with playing Pretty Woman.  Looking at the chords it is:

A.       F#m
A.       F#m
D.       E.            B5.       E
B5.     E.            B5.       E.     B5.    E

I am asking out of my ignorance hoping to learn something.  Why couldn't it be played:

Capo 2

G.    Em.     
G.    Em
C.    D.        A5.   D
A5.  D.        A5.   D.    A5.  D

Would that give you the key of A and a lower register.  Everyone wins. 

Again, Im asking out of my definite lack of understanding as to what you are trying to accomplish.
Hoping to have an Ah ha moment.

DO18...not sure  what youre asking but the 2 options  you listed would be the exact same key either way...maybe I'm misunderstanding your question

[DO18]

Very interesting read and I am in no way familiar with playing Pretty Woman.  Looking at the chords it is:

A.       F#m
A.       F#m
D.       E.            B5.       E
B5.     E.            B5.       E.     B5.    E

I am asking out of my ignorance hoping to learn something.  Why couldn't it be played:

Capo 2

G.    Em.     
G.    Em
C.    D.        A5.   D
A5.  D.        A5.   D.    A5.  D

Would that give you the key of A and a lower register.  Everyone wins. 

Again, Im asking out of my definite lack of understanding as to what you are trying to accomplish.
Hoping to have an Ah ha moment.

DO18...not sure  what youre asking but the 2 options  you listed would be the exact same key either way...maybe I'm misunderstanding your question

I was asking why the OP could not play it with Capo 2 and still play in the original key.  Possibly satisfying everyone's objections.  Thanks for your response.

[KM Frye]

I've done it in G. It's only a full tone down from the original and my aging voice (64+yrs) can still handle it there.  Playing it in G with a capo on 2 is simply playing in A with different fingering.

Try it in G. Use the chart above, which looks to be all you really need .   

BTW- a great many famous voices lower the key a half or whole step as they age.  Nothing to be ashamed of at all.  This is a tad off-topic, but I recently watched a PBS Engelbert Humperdinck concert, taped this year (2018). The man is in his early 80's and can still sound like he did in 1967. However, play along with "Release Me" and you'll find out it's been dropped from the original F..  but even I didn't notice until I grabbed my T5z.

(Edit- `Pretty Woman` in G would actually require drop D tuning in order to play the opening lick in the low register, but with a little practice, that one string can be done on the fly in about two seconds.  Apologies for the oversight)