New Martin 12-string an attempt to keep up with Taylor?

[Judson H]

I just noticed that Martin has introduced a brand new 12-string ... the GCPA12-4 ... that appears to be a direct attempt to compete with the Taylor GA 12's ...

http://www.martinguitar.com/acoustic-electric/item/3194-gpc12pa4.html

The entire Martin "Performing Artist" line appears to be a reaction to Taylor's well-established position in the acoustic/electric market.

[ctkarslake]

It seems you are on to something Mr. Blackville.  What company wouldn't want to keep up with Taylor?  "Richlite" for fretboard material?  Never heard of such a thing!

[Steve]

True story:

We're at the MIAC Show in Toronto. MIAC is kinda' like a mini-NAMM for Canadians.

Bruce Mariano, the International Sales Manager for Martin, is a dear, dear friend of mine, so I wanted to go over to their booth and say hi.

I walk up to their booth and, lo and behold, there's one of the new "Performing Artist" Series guitars; the one that looks like the 814ce. Bruce saw me walk up and didn't say a word. I picked up the guitar and didn't say a word. I looked it over while he was texting, every so often looking up over his phone to try to gauge my reaction to what was clearly a Taylor rip off.

I put the guitar back on its stand, looked at Bruce while I shrugged my shoulders and said "What the Hell? It worked for us" and walked away.

Later that evening we had a good laugh over it.

Yeah, these Martins certainly look to be Taylor rip-offs. But you know what? Anyone who's ever built a Dreadnaught has ripped off Martin...

[sachi]

From what I've read, the Performing Artist guitars are specifically designed to be used amplified. In other words, the focus is on the amplified sound and less on the acoustic sound.  Taylor, on the other hand, always focuses on the acoustic sound, and the amplification system is secondary. What Martin hopes to do is appeal to the folks who need a good sound for performing; it has plenty of other guitars for folks who want the best acoustic sound.

The one thing that's very Taylor-like is the inane pickguard on the OM guitars. I'm no fan of it, that's for sure.

[Edward]

I don't know anything about the Martin Performance guits.
But I personally don't think that Taylor's amplification effort  are a "secondary" thought.  After having used all manners of pickup systems, they pioneered their own proprietary "ES" back in 2003 ...at what must have been considerable cost for R&D, not to mention the consultation of the renowned Rupert Neve, and then proceeded to revamp the ES two more times.  That, IMHO, is no secondary priority, or they would have continued to use existing pickup systems as all other makers have done and still continue to do.  Not arguing; just sayin

Back to the Martin Performer Series (of which, again, I know nothing about ...lol): I do find it a bit humorous that way back when I recall Taylor being derided by many a Martin loyalist/devotee (in forums) that Taylor was not as "serious" of an acoustic.  Sure folks use em on stage, but a "real acoustic" sounds great unplugged ...yada yada yada.  Irony is a beuatiful thing.  Few things speak louder than "success."  Or rather, imitation is the most sincere form of flattery...

Edward

[Steve]

Taylor, on the other hand, always focuses on the acoustic sound, and the amplification system is secondary.

Yeah, that whole ES thing was an afterthought...

 

[Steve]

Even the fingerboard inlay was a ripoff:

[sachi]

Yeah, that whole ES thing was an afterthought...

Oh no, I think that's taking my thoughts too far, Steve (and Edward). There's no question that Taylor's spent a lot of effort on trying to make the ES a good system. I was trying to point out that Martin was trying to make a guitar that was focused on amplified sound, to the potential detriment of the acoustic sound. You can read a lot of posts by Martin folks who use the Performing Artists on stage but make no bones that they are not the best pure acoustic choices.

Does that make more sense now?

[Steve]

Sure does, thanks!

[Edward]

Gotcha. 
And no biggie, of course

Edward

[sachi]

Thanks guys. I do try to be accurate when I talk about our guitars.

[michaelw]

from what i see spec-wise, most of the performing artist series use a bracing pattern & neckjoint that appears
to be similar to the 16 series, with the neck profile & the grand performance body shape being the 'all-new' part

Taylor seems to have all but relinquished the standard 12 string models to the GS shape for this year, save for the
GA3/4-12 & LKSM, while the grand performance body shape is closest in dimensions, albeit a bit smaller than the GA

martin has expanded the performing artist series to 20+ models in a relatively short period of time &
added a lower profile, 1 3/4" nut & more graduated neck taper to some of their standard (& 'HP') models
perhaps due to consumer & dealer input, they may have felt a need for something a little more 'modern'

the way i look at it is that Taylor has been rather heavily CE since 98 & with the GS in 06 & the acoustic line in 07
it appeared that Taylor may  have wanted to 'return to their roots' a little bit, as the T5, SB & T3 models rolled out

seeing that Taylor is now, & has been, outselling martin for 11 out of the 12 months a year for
the past few years, i think that martin has begun to 'step up their game' a little, so-to-speak ...

can't wait to see/hear/play the redesigned (Taylor) jumbo & the yet-to-be-released new model

[jmg257]

Had a GPCPA1 for a bit...it was a wonderful guitar.  It got me into acoustics in a big way.  Lots of tone and volume, good bass, easy to play, sweet looker...I really looked forward to picking it up, day after day for months.

 After adding a couple dreads, I just didn't use it so much.  Eventually when looking for something different, I A/B it with a few Taylors and the tone was pretty close.  I ended up trading it towards an 815 cause I loved the florentine cut, otherwise an 814/6 vs a PA is a real pick 'em (with a nod to the NT neck).

[Von Beerhofen]

Kind of reminds me of an era when certain Japanese companies did a very good job of copying top american brands resulting in several lawsuits, much to my enjoyment as I got one too, .
Ofcourse these guitars are entirely different, aside from US manufactured, so I guess it's OK then.
I could now proudly say, that guitar only looks like a Taylor but it isn't one, sorry! But I won't, as I would probably get whacked one over the head by it's owner.
BTW, I've seen the same trend in low to medium cost Asiatic productions.

Ludwig

[Steve]

Kind of reminds me of an era when certain Japanese companies did a very good job of copying top american brands resulting in several lawsuits, much to my enjoyment as I got one too...

I remember seeing Stephen Stills play in a club in Charleston, SC back in the mid 1980's. Here's a guy who now has a Signature Model D-45, and he was playing a Takamine "lawsuit" model.

Sounded good, too...