Unofficial Taylor Guitar Forum - UTGF
Taylor Acoustic & Electric Guitars => Taylor Acoustic & Electric Guitars => Topic started by: cigarfan on March 28, 2012, 06:15:10 PM
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This looks to be pretty accurate to my ears but I haven't heard them all. Comes from the Breedlove folks. You folks have an opinion?
http://collingsforum.com/eve/forums/a/ga/ul/759100063/inlineimg/Y/BreedloveChart1.jpg (http://collingsforum.com/eve/forums/a/ga/ul/759100063/inlineimg/Y/BreedloveChart1.jpg)
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They left out Brazilian Imbuia. :o Can't help you much because I have not played a guitar made with Myrtlewood, Striped Ebony, or Ziricote. Geeez I got to get out more. :-[
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They left out Brazilian Imbuia. :o Can't help you much because I have not play a guitar made with Myrtlewood, Striped Ebony, or Ziricote. Geeez I got to get out more. :-[
Actually, there are quite a few missing from this list ... Bubinga, Blackwood, Cocobolo to name a few others!
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Breedlove may not have left any out if the graphic was intended to represent the woods commonly used by Breedlove. Does Breedlove ever use sapele or ovangkol?
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Breedlove may not have left any out if the graphic was intended to represent the woods commonly used by Breedlove. Does Breedlove ever use sapele or ovangkol?
ovangkol laminate is used on some of the passport/atlas models (made overseas)
i see sapele listed in their custom shop -
the upcharge for quilted sapele ('the tree' ?) is :o
http://breedlovemusic.com/custom-shop/build-to-order (http://breedlovemusic.com/custom-shop/build-to-order)
hmm ... build to order :-\
a more linear representation, showing more of an overall range on the x-axis &
mid bump, scoop or relatively flat response as the variation on the y-axis is easier
for me to read & interpret & on a chart like this, if mahogany was closer to the center &
the rest of the 'graph' adjusted to it's response in terms of lows, mids & highs
it might make a little more sense (again, probably just to me), but it is what it is -
don't care much for their thicknessing & JLD bridge system, but that's just me
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My EIR 420-R is a lot brighter than my mahogany 410 but according to this matrix it shouldn't be. I think the linear graph that Taylor used to have on their website is a more accurate way of depicting frequency response.
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I find this chart no less useful than Breedlove's:
(http://i139.photobucket.com/albums/q298/Swablr/TaylorToneChart.jpg)
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What surprised me about Breedlove's chart is where he places rosewood. I had always thought that rosewood was desired for its clarity and brightness, not lows. But I am far from anything resembling expertise on this.
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I always wondered why we have ALL Koa, Hog, etc guitars. Has anyone ever had or seen an all EIR guitar? Would it work to have rosewood as a top etc?
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Yeah, I've wondered the same thing about an all rosewood guitar. Seems like the thing would be a cannon! Take the back off my jumbo and make a top out of it.... wow, it would be a stunner!
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a more linear representation, showing more of an overall range on the x-axis &
mid bump, scoop or relatively flat response as the variation on the y-axis is easier
for me to read & interpret & on a chart like this, if mahogany was closer to the center &
the rest of the 'graph' adjusted to it's response in terms of lows, mids & highs
it might make a little more sense
Got a business trip coming up but when I get back I think I'll try and experiment. Maybe develop a UTGF tonewoods matrix with input from everyone here.
michaelw, I think your x and y description above would be a good place to start. I'll work up a template where each of us could locate the woods we know. Then do a mean average for the final display.
These are the tonewoods I could find. Let me know if I missed any. And certainly don't worry if you are not familiar with any of these. We'll just rate what we know.
And, feel free to tell me this is a crazy idea if you think so! Just thought a chart developed by our ears would mean more to me than the others I've seen.
Back and Sides
African Satinwood
Ancient Kauri
Blackheart Sassafras
Blackwood
Bubinga
Chechen
Cocobolo
Granadillo (often referred to as Black Cocobolo)
Hormigo
Koa
Lacewood
Macassar Ebony
Mahogany
Maple (Big leaf)
Maple (European)
Monkey Pod
Myrtlewood
Ovangkol
Paduak
Pau Ferro (also known as Morado or Bolivian Rosewood)
Purple Heart
Rosewood (Amazon)
Rosewood (Brazilian)
Rosewood (East Indian)
Rosewood (Honduran)
Rosewood (Madagascar )
Sapele
Snakewood
Sycamore
Walnut (Black)
Walnut (Claro)
Walnut (White)
Wenge
Ziricote
Soundboard (Top)
Adirondack Spruce (also known as Eastern Red Spruce and Appalachian Spruce)
Englemann Spruce
European Spruce
Italian Spruce
Redwood
Sinker Redwood
Sitka Spruce
Western Red Cedar
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It would be interesting and very informative to do a matrix of sorts for top woods as well, good idea! Would it be logical to use the same "frequency response" dynamic for tops as for the b/s woods?
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Soundboard (Top)
Adirondack Spruce (also known as Eastern Red Spruce and Appalachian Spruce)
Englemann Spruce
European Spruce
Italian Spruce
Redwood
Sinker Redwood
Sitka Spruce
Western Red Cedar
I notice the list contains Engelmann spruce, European spruce and Italian spruce. Italian spruce is European spruce and virtually all European spruce is Picea abies except when it is Engelmann spruce (Picea engelmannii) imported from the U.S. and exported back to the U.S. labeled as German or European spruce.
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imported from the U.S. and exported back to the U.S. labeled as German or European spruce.
Now there is some expert marketing.
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imported from the U.S. and exported back to the U.S. labeled as German or European spruce.
Now there is some expert marketing.
just like oil ::)
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I always wondered why we have ALL Koa, Hog, etc guitars. Has anyone ever had or seen an all EIR guitar? Would it work to have rosewood as a top etc?
There have been a few, jj, and there have been some posts about them over on the AGF. They apparently don't work all that well. Rosewood is a hard wood and reflects sound well, but it does not move much so does not suit as a topwood.
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I always wondered why we have ALL Koa, Hog, etc guitars. Has anyone ever had or seen an all EIR guitar? Would it work to have rosewood as a top etc?
You can certainly use Rosewood for a top but tonally you would not gain anything over Spruce. About ten years ago I had Breedlove build me an all Walnut CM that was truly a work of art but tonally my standard Walnut/Spruce CM was superior in every way.
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Tradional wood pairings have become traditional for a good reason ... in general Rosewood with Sitka or Englemann have always appealed to me ... I have also become fond of Walnut with Sitka. I'm sure an all Rosewood guitar would be pretty but I doubt if it would really sing with the soundboard/top being Rosewood. It might be a darker tone that some would like ... I say this having been surprised by an all Mahogany guitar a couple of years ago. It would not be my only guitar, but that all Mahogany had something special ...
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I always wondered why we have ALL Koa, Hog, etc guitars. Has anyone ever had or seen an all EIR guitar? Would it work to have rosewood as a top etc?
whatever top that has been used on a T5 could likely be used
on an acoustic, but it may not sound 'the greatest' played acoustically -
rosewood, cocobolo, macassar ebony, maple ...
tasmanian blackwood & walnut are good, as is imbuia &
i imagine ovangkol (like on the T5-X) would be pretty nice on a GS
myrtlewood & satinwood are not currently on the BTO 'menu' &
aa-quilt maple has been absent for a while, but if it ever comes back :o
i'd like this kind of top on a GS-c BTO ;) (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Taylor-T5-Guitar-Blue-Edgeburst-with-case-/320832760370?pt=Guitar&hash=item4ab31f6a32#ht_513wt_1270)
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These are the tonewoods I could find. Let me know if I missed any. And certainly don't worry if you are not familiar with any of these. We'll just rate what we know.
There is one tone wood that is very seldom seen. Guild guitar used it for a short time in the early to mid 1980’s with fantastic results, the D46. Solid Ash back and sides with a Sitka spruce top. It gives you the lows like rose wood and the mid and highs like maple. I know Washburn uses ash in a few guitars; I’ve played them and was disappointed. They just don’t seem to have it right IMHO. But also having a D46, I know what beautiful tones Ash can give.
(http://i636.photobucket.com/albums/uu88/Dane59/1985%20Guild%20D-46%20Blond/Guild009-2.jpg)
(http://i636.photobucket.com/albums/uu88/Dane59/1985%20Guild%20D-46%20Blond/Guild010-2.jpg)
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There is one tone wood that is very seldom seen. Guild guitar used it for a short time in the early to mid 1980’s with fantastic results, the D46. Solid Ash back and sides with a Sitka spruce top. It gives you the lows like rose wood and the mid and highs like maple. I know Washburn uses ash in a few guitars; I’ve played them and was disappointed. They just don’t seem to have it right IMHO. But also having a D46, I know what beautiful tones Ash can give.
(http://i636.photobucket.com/albums/uu88/Dane59/1985%20Guild%20D-46%20Blond/Guild009-2.jpg)
Pappy ... that is one purdy gitar!
Ash has been added to the list.
In addition I have added quite a few more. The current list is:
African Satinwood
Alder
Ancient Kauri
Ash
Basswood
Black limba
Blackheart Sassafras
Blackwood
Bocote
Bubinga
Butternut
Canalete
Chechen
Cocobolo
Granadillo (often referred to as Black Cocobolo)
Hormigo
Hormigo
Imbuia (also called Brazilian Walnut)
Koa
Korina (Black)
Korina (White)
Lacewood
Macassar Ebony
Mahogany
Makore
Maple (Big leaf)
Maple (Birds Eye)
Maple (European)
Meranti
Monkey Pod
Muira Piranga
Myrtlewood
Oak
Ovangkol
Padauk (African)
Padauk (Andaman)
Pau Ferro (also known as Morado or Bolivian Rosewood)
Pear
Poplar
Poplar (Tulip)
Purple Heart
Rosewood (Amazon)
Rosewood (Brazilian)
Rosewood (East Indian)
Rosewood (Honduran)
Rosewood (Madagascar )
Sapele
Snakewood
Sycamore
Teak
Walnut (Black)
Walnut (Claro)
Walnut (White)
Wenge
Zebrano
Zebrawood
Ziricote