Unofficial Taylor Guitar Forum - UTGF
Lessons, Recordings, How Tos, Repair, Accessories => Lessons, Recordings, How Tos, Repair, Accessories => Topic started by: icy_wind500 on November 14, 2014, 05:31:55 AM
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These white marks on the fretboard is getting very annoying! I was told that it will go away once I oil it. It went away for a few days and now its coming back. Is this actually normal?
(https://fbcdn-sphotos-c-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xap1/v/t1.0-9/s720x720/10698619_10154795127165066_1008902112871844685_n.jpg?oh=53e4702a957eb03c8aaee847a0ff38eb&oe=551DB270&__gda__=1424382667_ee491c761dab03c10c4367b75d9bf791)
(https://fbcdn-sphotos-e-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xap1/v/t1.0-9/s720x720/10614148_10154795126610066_7409660371938968028_n.jpg?oh=722508f0c7ad0918eecfb0ec608b861e&oe=551B129D&__gda__=1423676198_77882014b0fa2dbd0e66ed725e321103)
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Wow, I've never seen that before.
Did you try using the 0000 weight steel wool a lot of people use before oiling it?
This is the rec from this Taylor page (http://www.taylorguitars.com/blog/taylor-support/faq-how-should-i-clean-or-polish-my-guitar):
To clean the fingerboard, we use and recommend 0000 extra-fine steel wool. Simply rub the steel wool up and down the length of the fingerboard right over the tops of the frets. This will remove any grime from the fingerboard without damaging the wood and will also remove any oxidation from the frets, giving them a nice shine.
Maybe that will help remove the deposits making those white marks?
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Wow, that looks remarkably like the "dog hair" finish that appears on some Collings instruments. They use a white pore filler before final finishing to bring out the contrast.
Just speculating here, but have you polished this fretboard with furniture polish or wax? That is kinda what it looks like to me. If not, then this is an accumulation of dirt and grime in the pores of the wood, but I would expect that to be more uneven - more spots where you play / fret a lot and fewer up the neck and in relatively unplayed areas. Also, what kind of oil did you use? That koa guitar should have an ebony fretboard, but the fairly coarse grain looks more like rosewood.
I also suggest you call Taylor customer service and send this photo to them. They will likely have some suggestions too. You might end up needing to gently scrub the fretboard using a toothbrush and a mild solvent such as naptha (Ronsonol lighter fluid) known to not harm the finish. As always test some small area first. Don't want any nasty surprises.....
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Looks like it has been waxed to me, too. The naphtha and a toothbrush suggestion should get it out. Then use a little lemon oil and it should turn out ok. Good luck.
Don
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It almost looks like some kind of wax or polish.
I would NEVER use steel wool on a fretboard. (Especially if it's an electric git). Ever get a strand stuck in your fingers? I do agree with the above suggestion of using a brush to get in the pores, possibly a soft surgeons scrub brush and some cleaner like simple green. Then use some pure or boiled linseed oil, don't let it marinate, just apply it and "quickly" wipe it off with a new rag. :)
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... I would NEVER use steel wool on a fretboard. (Especially if it's an electric git). Ever get a strand stuck in your fingers...?
Not discounting what you're saying about getting a strand of steel wool in your finger; but 0000 steel wool is so fine as to be little more than the texture of dryer lint. I've successfully used a damp paper towel to wipe off the fretboard after using the steel wool, and the towel tends to grab all of the residue that I couldn't simply blow off.
What tends to be tricky about removing on ES-equpped guitars is the ferrous residue that accumulates around the base of the fretboard, where it meets the upper bout. The neck/string sensor apparently has a magnet powerful enough to attract that light steel wool residue and hold it in the little 'nook' between the fretboard and the top... I certainly couldn't blow it off...
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It almost looks like some kind of wax or polish.
I would NEVER use steel wool on a fretboard. (Especially if it's an electric git). Ever get a strand stuck in your fingers? I do agree with the above suggestion of using a brush to get in the pores, possibly a soft surgeons scrub brush and some cleaner like simple green. Then use some pure or boiled linseed oil, don't let it marinate, just apply it and "quickly" wipe it off with a new rag. :)
Also, don't "tear" the steel wool off the bolt, use an old scissors and "cut" it if you need a smaller piece. Lots less particles to deal with.
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I hope somebody from Taylor reads the "NEVER use steel wool" suggestion so they can stop recommending this terrible practice and stop doing it in their factory as well recommending it to guitar techs/luthiers and all owners. This surely must be stopped.
Sorry for the sarcasm, but I couldn't resist. I've NEVER had occasion to use steel wool myself (tho I think a luthier has on my guitars) but I feel pretty secure that if the proper methods are applied per the Taylor instructions, the fretboards of our Taylors (and other guitars) can be well maintained per the Taylor site's recommendations.
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I hope somebody from Taylor reads the "NEVER use steel wool" suggestion so they can stop recommending this terrible practice and stop doing it in their factory as well recommending it to guitar techs/luthiers and all owners. This surely must be stopped.
Sorry for the sarcasm, but I couldn't resist. I've NEVER had occasion to use steel wool myself (tho I think a luthier has on my guitars) but I feel pretty secure that if the proper methods are applied per the Taylor instructions, the fretboards of our Taylors (and other guitars) can be well maintained per the Taylor site's recommendations.
It may not be so bad on an acoustic only but did you ever try to get those particulates off/out of a magnetic PUP? Or be in the middle of a gig and have your electronics die because a piece of "steel" strand got onto the ES circuit board and shorted a land pattern? Or worse yet have your ES circuitry go intermittent? Now that will drive you batty trying to find that short.
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If you watch the Taylor cleaning videos, they tape off the sound hole first for just this reason.
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Might be worth running by your official Taylor dealer....just to see what they would suggest etc.
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Might be worth running by your official Taylor dealer....just to see what they would suggest etc.
Very true, they do tape off the hole. But it's amazing where those little buggars can end up. I once had an amp come into my shop that turned out to have a piece of aluminum foil floating around the inverter section of the chassis. Foil that I later identified as a "needle" from a vintage aluminum Christmas tree. How in the heck did that get in there! Oh well... ::)
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If you watch the Taylor cleaning videos, they tape off the sound hole first for just this reason.
Their string-changing literature recommends doing this; or using a towel to cover the sound hole, which is what I did.
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I've seen this before on ebony and primarily rosewood fretboards. (Some of them mine.) I am guessing, but I think it has to do with a chemical reaction between your body oil and salt/sweat (maybe even dead skin) causing this to build up in the grain marks in the wood. And I think it's only in the grain because it gets wiped away when you're playing on the flat parts of the wood, on the surface level. I highly suspect this is only a cosmetic issue, but as you say, it is annoying to look at.
Since you've already tried oil, how about rubbing in a good fretboard cleaner first, then oil again, taking your time and rubbing in really good. Use a soft old toothbrush, while 0000 steel wool won't damage anything, it's freaking messy, trust me.
At least my suggestion can do no harm and you'll have a clean, well oiled fretboard!
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I stand thrashed and defeated drrhole as it sounds like you, having your own shop, have a ton of experience dealing with this issue (with all sorts of magnetic devices) and what you say about using a brush instead of steel is, if anything, a more efficient approach so you don't have to waste time/effort taping off the sound hole, etc. Makes sense.
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I stand thrashed and defeated drrhole as it sounds like you, having your own shop, have a ton of experience dealing with this issue (with all sorts of magnetic devices) and what you say about using a brush instead of steel is, if anything, a more efficient approach so you don't have to waste time/effort taping off the sound hole, etc. Makes sense.
Thanks quitarsrsoawesome (they are aren't they)!
It's funny, I almost aspirated a whole can of never-dull when I went Huuuuuu - Seeing that Taylor fretboard cleaning video the first time. It just caught me by such surprise. ;)
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These white marks on the fretboard is getting very annoying! I was told that it will go away once I oil it. It went away for a few days and now its coming back. Is this actually normal?
to me, it looks like wax, fast fret or finger ease residue -
because the fretboard has wood inlays, rather than abalone,
MOP, or ivoroid, a little extra care should be taken, imho
naptha, pure naptha, is very powerful stuff
http://www.lowes.com/pd_247184-78-QVM46_0__?productId=3162199 (http://www.lowes.com/pd_247184-78-QVM46_0__?productId=3162199)
ronsonol lighter fluid used to contain naptha, but apparently it has
been reformulated in the past few years & no longer contains it
http://theunofficialmartinguitarforum.yuku.com/topic/136591#.VGbEmfnF_gw (http://theunofficialmartinguitarforum.yuku.com/topic/136591#.VGbEmfnF_gw)
i've had good results using ronsonol, 0000 steel wool & then
dr stringfellows (kyser) lemoil on a paper towel afterwards -
since your k24ce has ES2
http://www.unofficialtaylorguitarforum.com/index.php?topic=5702 (http://www.unofficialtaylorguitarforum.com/index.php?topic=5702)
the possibility of particles of steel wool sticking on the fretboard above the magnetic
neck sensor is a non-issue & even with ES1.1/2/3 guitars, i've cleaned fretboards using
this method & never had a problem, but if there happened to be any particles that a soft
nylon brush couldn't take care of, then a little 3M blue low tack painter's tape did the trick
http://www.worldpaintsupply.com/3m-scotch-blue-painters-tape-2080-low-tack-1-x-60-yd/ (http://www.worldpaintsupply.com/3m-scotch-blue-painters-tape-2080-low-tack-1-x-60-yd/)
practicing a reasonable amount of caution, not being too aggressive with the steel wool & using lemoil
sparingly (i put a bit on a quality paper towel folded over many times & then go back over it with a clean
paper towel (with the grain) & usually the fretboard will squeak when i'm done, letting me know it's dry
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Thanks everyone for the replies!
But I did use fast fret! I've used fast fret as a fretboard cleaner before with no problems. Does that mean I can't do it on this guitar? So I'll just get a tooth brush and lemon oil to work it out?
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I've just came back from my local hardware store and they have no idea what's naphtha or even lemon oil.... Hm.... Is there any alternatives that's available in Australia :(?
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lemoil
http://www.musiciansfriend.com/accessories/kyser-dr.-stringfellow-lem-oil (http://www.musiciansfriend.com/accessories/kyser-dr.-stringfellow-lem-oil)
ronsonol lighter fluid
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Ronson-Lighter-Fluid-133ml-can/dp/B00298IFN0 (http://www.amazon.co.uk/Ronson-Lighter-Fluid-133ml-can/dp/B00298IFN0)
using a toothbrush & 'scrubbing' with lemoil may result
in spots of oil being directed where they are not desired
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Could I perhaps brush it without any liquid?
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Could I perhaps brush it without any liquid?
Wont hurt to try, if you're using a soft brush.
Might sound odd but one of the best non-toxic de-greasers/solvents around is "spit". You'll need a lot to do the whole fret board but give it a try. Spit on a terry cloth wash rag and rub away. Won't hurt a thing! 8)
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What tends to be tricky about removing on ES-equpped guitars is the ferrous residue that accumulates around the base of the fretboard, where it meets the upper bout. The neck/string sensor apparently has a magnet powerful enough to attract that light steel wool residue and hold it in the little 'nook' between the fretboard and the top... I certainly couldn't blow it off...
Another magnet will remove it, just be careful so as not to possibly change the magnetic field of the pickups themselves, e.g., move the magnet away from the pickups instead of moving it around back and forth in the pickup's magnetic field.
Their string-changing literature recommends doing this; or using a towel to cover the sound hole, which is what I did.
I tend to use the towel myself, as its quicker and easier.
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What tends to be tricky about removing on ES-equpped guitars is the ferrous residue that accumulates around the base of the fretboard, where it meets the upper bout. The neck/string sensor apparently has a magnet powerful enough to attract that light steel wool residue and hold it in the little 'nook' between the fretboard and the top... I certainly couldn't blow it off...
Another magnet will remove it, just be careful so as not to possibly change the magnetic field of the pickups themselves, e.g., move the magnet away from the pickups instead of moving it around back and forth in the pickup's magnetic field.
Ooh, yeah -- good point! Don't want to flux up the magnets in the pick-up...! ;)
I'm thinking there's got to be a safe, easy way to remove the steel wool residue -- one that won't endanger pick-up magnets or the finish -- but I'm a bit stumped at the moment. Maybe I'll try a vacuum cleaner hose...?
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You could pick up the stray steel wool fiber's with some low-tack masking tape, or possibly a lightly damped paper towl. I've been cleaning fretboards for years with steel wool, and this gets the stray particles for me.
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You could pick up the stray steel wool fiber's with some low-tack masking tape, or possibly a lightly damped paper towl. I've been cleaning fretboards for years with steel wool, and this gets the stray particles for me.
I thought about tape or a paper towel, but it seems like it would be difficult to get into the very deep corners between the fretboard and top...
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ok.... I have tried the toothbrush by itself and it didn't work one bit.
Then I taped off the hole and used steel wool, it took some out and its still visible. The white lines are lighter though.
Next I vacuumed the steel wool remains and wiped it down with a dampened cloth. Its alittle bit better but the ebony look so pale now. I guess I have get my hands on some lemon oil!
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I had a pro fret dress performed on a Les Paul with an ebony board. I fought with that board from time to time with similar marks. When I got the guitar back from the fret dress, the board had a great black shine and looked better than new. It was also very slick and "fast". I asked the guy what he put on it and he said nothing at all. He polished the frets and board with some sort of buffer wheel. I have been tempted to take him other guitars and just ask for a fret board polish.
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Just saw this, FYI....
http://www.premierguitar.com/articles/19800-guitar-shop-101-the-great-guitar-cleanup?page=3 (http://www.premierguitar.com/articles/19800-guitar-shop-101-the-great-guitar-cleanup?page=3)
(http://www.premierguitar.com/ext/resources/images/content/2013_10/Blogs/Dec13_PG_CLM_-GuitarShop101_image8_WEB.jpg)
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Just saw this, FYI....
http://www.premierguitar.com/articles/19800-guitar-shop-101-the-great-guitar-cleanup?page=3 (http://www.premierguitar.com/articles/19800-guitar-shop-101-the-great-guitar-cleanup?page=3)
(http://www.premierguitar.com/ext/resources/images/content/2013_10/Blogs/Dec13_PG_CLM_-GuitarShop101_image8_WEB.jpg)
Interesting comment from this article:
I have been using clarinet Bore oil on my rosewood and ebony unfinished fretboards and bridges for decades. It was designed to keep the inner bore of clarinets, traditionally made from ebony, from drying out. A few drops in each fret space and wipe with a clean cloth. Available at any music store, Selmer has a bore oil in 1 1/2 oz bottle for a few bucks or Conn has an 8 oz bottle for about 7 bucks which should last for years.