Unofficial Taylor Guitar Forum - UTGF
Taylor Acoustic & Electric Guitars => Taylor Acoustic & Electric Guitars => Topic started by: Herb Hunter on February 08, 2013, 08:19:43 AM
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Last Saturday, I drove back to New Hampshire from my home in Maine to pickup the 918e. Two days earlier I had called the dealer to make sure he had received my check for the difference between the trade-in value and the price of the 918e. The dealer confirmed he had received it. Once there, since I had the acoustic guitar room to myself, I decided to play my guitar one last time. After a few minutes I put it in its case and picked up the 918e and played it.
This time, what stood out was not only the overall high volume of the grand orchestra guitar and the strong low notes but the fact that the wound strings, while not as muffled sounding as guitars from the brands with a long heritage, were more muffled than my Engelmann spruce / Brazilian rosewood grand auditorium. As I played on I began to realize that the muted highs of those strings would bother me more than the guitar's virtues would please me. I did consider the grand orchestra guitar would still complement my other grand auditorium guitars but also realized I probably wouldn't play it very much because of the reduced shimmer.
I decided to keep my 16 year old Engelmann spruce/ Brazilian rosewood, grand auditorium guitar and the dealer graciously wrote me a check for the amount I had sent him earlier in the week. Nevertheless, I was embarrassed for having uncharacteristically changed my mind.
I learned to play on a classical guitar so when I turn to a steel-string I certainly don't want a mellow sound but even my bespoke classical guitar, made with spruce from Germany and maple from Canada, is brighter than many classical guitars that I find too muffled.
The grand orchestra guitar is truly impressive. I think it is likely that the bracing of the grand orchestra will become as significant a development as X bracing. I would love to be around when someone shows up at a bluegrass meet with a 918 to see the reactions.
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Herb,
Good report. I was puzzled, not surprised though, with your possible trade of the Brazilian rosewood. I think it is a very good piece of advice to take your present guitar with you when you go to purchase something new. That has saved me on several occasions from buying another guitar and maybe having buyer's remorse. I would not worry about changing your mind. I change my mind with guitars all the time and luckily my dealer is a friend who has enormous patience!
Do you have any pics of your Brazilian?
davidc
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Great story Herb. Thanks for sharing it. That lack of shimmer is what keeps some from GS models and CV bracing at times. If that is what really grabs your ears, you will certainly notice when it is diminished.
I think you made a wise decision and saved yourself from buyers remorse.
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Thanks, I am considering a trade of my Adi over Coco GS for a 918e, and my experience may very well have been similar to yours. Considering my GS has adi CV bracing as well, perhaps I would be dissapointed. Your post may save me alot of hassle.
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I decided to keep my 16 year old Engelmann spruce/ Brazilian rosewood, grand auditorium guitar and the dealer graciously wrote me a check for the amount I had sent him earlier in the week. Nevertheless, I was embarrassed for having uncharacteristically changed my mind.
That shows the good qualities of a dealer, assuming he did not give you grief about it. Really though it is no skin of his back, he will sell that guitar soon.
In my opinion you should not be hard on yourself. If the guitar does not WOW you why do it? Buying a guitar because someone else says it is awesome does not mean you need it as well. Now adding that GO to your collection someday might be the answer for a nice addition to your tonal pallet. In my mind I would have a very hard time releasing a Spruce/Brazilian Rosewood.
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You shouldn't be embarrassed, Herb. At least you didn't just get caught up with GAS...you made an informed decision which is one you will always appreciate. Had you bought the new guitar and traded your GA, most likely you would have regretted it for the rest of your life. It's good to know that a 16 year old GA can go head-to-head with a brand new GO and still come out on top! That says something about Taylor's quality! ;)
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Thanks for your post Herb. Just goes to to show the proof is in the playing. Can't say I'm surprised that 16 yr old Brazilian beats out young EIR.
My experience with getting the 618 was quite different. I had an all mahogany GS-LTD (about a yr old) that I traded in. Didn't get to a/b the two but I can tell you the shimmer on my new 618 is much more prevalent than the GS. But that is comparing mahogany to sitka/maple not to mention the new bracing.
I'm glad it has turned out positively for both of us.
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I think Herb would be the first one to say that the primary take-away from this event is that he believes his current guitar is more pleasing to his ear than that specific 918. It's possible that another 918 may sound better. Or even worse.
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It is possible the piece of bone that particular saddle was made out of was inconsistent in density.
Asking to swap out saddles with a Tusq one and a set of strings, provided one's preference is something other than Elixir 80/20 NanoWebs, may have changed things a bit or it may not have.
If the end result was still the GA over the GO, I would have compensated the dealer for the strings, another set of NanoWebs to return the guitar to the way it was shipped from the factory and their time to have their tech take care of it, along with buying a few extra items.
New doesn't always win.
The dealer deserves kudos for allowing the transaction to be reversed without a fee.
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Seriously huge kudos to the dealer ...take it back w/o "restocking fee"?? Wow, and nice!
Truth be told, Herb, I was shocked when I first read you were going to trade old-braz for a new guit! I figured, surprised as I was, that maybe you just wanted something in a different direction. As nice as the GOs apparently are (haven't tried one yet ...and am afraid it may incite "feelings" ;) ), it's great to see that you kept the braz. Clearly you find it nicer, and that's all that counts.
On a bit of a tangent, I have to say that it is very gratifying to compare one's own current instrument to another and find yours still makes you feel like you won the lotto. And even more satisfying when the new instrument you're comparing to has a higher price tag. It reminds me of what Bob recently wrote in W&S about keeping those old guits instead of constantly vying for the new flavor. I've done this a few times ...felt the desire for another guit, then compared with what I had...then passed realizing I already own the winning ticket. And I've done this when comparing with other T's as well as other high-end guits. It really is a good feeling, for me, anyway. Congrats on your "new" old guitar day! :)
Edward
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Sometimes you discover what you have is really what you want. Glad it all worked out before your guitar went away, and the dealer was accommodating... no doubt, he kept you as a customer, and won't have a problem finding another home for that 918 (someone who doesn't already own that "lifetime" guitar).
Best wishes,
Jim
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Had a similar experience a year or two after I bought my 210. I came across a really great looking 410 that I thought I had to have, so I sold my 210 to a friend who was looking to by a Taylor and bought the 410. Over the weekend I realized my mistake so I contacted the store -- who were much more accommodating than they could have been -- and got nearly all my money back. Then I called my friend, who told me he figured I'd change my mind and that he enjoyed playing my 210 for a weekend. (He got a great deal on a 310 shortly after, so it was a happy ending for both of us.)
Lesson learned.
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I'll also chime in, because I've known Herb through the years on these forums.
Based upon your stated tastes, I was also surprised that you would choose that GO over your Braz/engelmann GA, but I was not surprised when you reconsidered. I do agree with you that the GO will challenge people's preconceptions about what a larger guitar is capable of, especially when it's compared to a dreadnought (or the GS for that matter). The 518 I played was an excellent specimen - it just wasn't for me. I'm glad you kept your 16-year-old friend; there will be no limit to potential "new friends" down the road.
God bless...
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I played all three models. The model tha twon me over was the 518e. For me I would rather have my 816ce over the 918e. the 918e just sounded a bit to oscooped and mellower. just not the mid range punch. The 518e was powerful and had great overtones. notes JUMPED ouit with out sounded mellow or scooped in the mids.
I just came away feeling that the the Hog REALLY works well with the larger body and bracing. The 918e just did not come across as a suped up GS in rosewood.
The maple was loud and bold but had a lack in overtones I like and just a bit too quick note decay. Not a bad thing really just not MY cup of tea. Actually the 518e sounded more like my 816ce suped up than the 918e did.
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I own a 918e and am very pleased with it, but I think you made a very wise move. And I agree with a few here who indicated they would have had a hard time trading in the Brazilian...I think if you have a Brazilian, and you like it, hold on....
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Trading a guitar you like for a new one you want makes little sense, even if that new guitar you want is the 918e. The thing to do, if possible is to add that 918e to the stable without getting rid of any keepers. :)
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I have heard all of the models and the 918 is the least impressive. The other two are va va voom, especially the 518 and I wonder why that is?
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Last Saturday, I drove back to New Hampshire from my home in Maine to pickup the 918e. Two days earlier I had called the dealer to make sure he had received my check for the difference between the trade-in value and the price of the 918e. The dealer confirmed he had received it. Once there, since I had the acoustic guitar room to myself, I decided to play my guitar one last time. After a few minutes I put it in its case and picked up the 918e and played it.
This time, what stood out was not only the overall high volume of the grand orchestra guitar and the strong low notes but the fact that the wound strings, while not as muffled sounding as guitars from the brands with a long heritage, were more muffled than my Engelmann spruce / Brazilian rosewood grand auditorium. As I played on I began to realize that the muted highs of those strings would bother me more than the guitar's virtues would please me. I did consider the grand orchestra guitar would still complement my other grand auditorium guitars but also realized I probably wouldn't play it very much because of the reduced shimmer.
I decided to keep my 16 year old Engelmann spruce/ Brazilian rosewood, grand auditorium guitar and the dealer graciously wrote me a check for the amount I had sent him earlier in the week. Nevertheless, I was embarrassed for having uncharacteristically changed my mind.
I learned to play on a classical guitar so when I turn to a steel-string I certainly don't want a mellow sound but even my bespoke classical guitar, made with spruce from Germany and maple from Canada, is brighter than many classical guitars that I find too muffled.
The grand orchestra guitar is truly impressive. I think it is likely that the bracing of the grand orchestra will become as significant a development as X bracing. I would love to be around when someone shows up at a bluegrass meet with a 918 to see the reactions.
I bet you are glad you realized it before it was too late! You sure have a great guitar that I would never part with! Glad everything worked out for you!
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Trading a guitar you like for a new one you want makes little sense, even if that new guitar you want is the 918e. The thing to do, if possible is to add that 918e to the stable without getting rid of any keepers. :)
If buying the 918 without trading in one of my guitars were an option for me, the title of this thread would be: I Added a 918 to My Guitar Collection.
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...Do you have any pics of your Brazilian?
davidc
Here is a photograph of my Brazilian rosewood grand auditorium:
(http://i139.photobucket.com/albums/q298/Swablr/IMG_0735b_zps1b3ea76e.jpg)
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Hmmmm, braz and full ab binding.... I vote for more pics, all angles, in HD; purely for the sake of full disclosure, mind you.
:D
Edward
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Hmmmm, braz and full ab binding.... I vote for more pics, all angles, in HD; purely for the sake of full disclosure, mind you.
:D
Edward
Agreed!
From what I see this guitar is a lifer.
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I decided to keep my 16 year old Engelmann spruce/ Brazilian rosewood, grand auditorium guitar and the dealer graciously wrote me a check for the amount I had sent him earlier in the week. Nevertheless, I was embarrassed for having uncharacteristically changed my mind.
There have been times when I should have changed my mind just like you did ... I commend you for taking the time and honest assessment and being willing to change your mind at the last minute ... these are big decisions for most of us ... nothing worse than getting a guitar home only to realize you are disappointed in some way ... also, pretty cool to learn you like what you already have ... :)
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Hmmmm, braz and full ab binding.... I vote for more pics, all angles, in HD; purely for the sake of full disclosure, mind you.
:D
Edward
(http://i139.photobucket.com/albums/q298/Swablr/IMG_0732b_zpsddcf8af1.jpg) (http://i139.photobucket.com/albums/q298/Swablr/IMG_0742b_zps20cbc1bb.jpg)
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I appreciate all the supportive comments I have received. Thanks.
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Yeow!!! That is one STUNNING guitar, Herb! 8) The abalone looks especially colorful. Is it regular abalone or something else? And for the record, what fretboard inlay design is used?
I love the smiley bridge pin formation, too. Have any idea why Taylor switched it?
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Yeow!!! That is one STUNNING guitar, Herb! 8) The abalone looks especially colorful. Is it regular abalone or something else? And for the record, what fretboard inlay design is used?
I love the smiley bridge pin formation, too. Have any idea why Taylor switched it?
Thank you for your complimentary comment.
The fretboard has Taylor's Byzantine inlay pattern and the inlay material used was select abalone. There are several species of abalone with paua having the reputation of being the most colorful so it is likely that the species of abalone used on my guitar was paua. This is reflected in the fretboard guide which shows the byzantine pattern on the last page and identifies the inlay material as paua:
http://www.taylorguitars.com/sites/default/files/2012-Inlay-Guide-taylor-guitars.pdf
I'm not aware that the bridge ornamentation has changed for guitars ordered with the Byzantine inlay pattern.
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WAIT one minute here ...full ab front, back, and fretboard extension, with byz inlay, in paua shell, replete with real Braz RW and AA Engelmann top ...and you wanted to trade for an off-the-shelf production-line GO?!!!
You feeling ok, Herb?? Apparently you're now feeling much better since you clearly came to your senses ...lol! :D
FWIW, I have a Custom DN with the paua shell on the front (only, not the back, unfortunately), and it is a stunning shell, seriously iridescent and changes hue/intensity given the angle ...very reminiscent to the RT's green-heart abalone. Gorgeous stuff this paua!
OK Herb, suffice it to say you've got an amazing stunner there. Clearly the tone is where any guitar is at, so suffice it to say, you've got a double threat: serious beauty and tone you love. How can one not celebrate? :)
Edward
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Yeow!!! That is one STUNNING guitar, Herb! 8) The abalone looks especially colorful. Is it regular abalone or something else? And for the record, what fretboard inlay design is used?
I love the smiley bridge pin formation, too. Have any idea why Taylor switched it?
I agree Cindy! That is a stunning guitar Herb!..and I love the old pattern for the endpins. I don't know why Taylor changed it. My 1998 415 jumbo looks great with it. The 2009 GS custom has the "updated" straight pin layout. I definitely like the older smiley look... It looks more like a custom guitar would. Now... if we could just get Taylor to change the headstock design to look like Bob Taylor's "R Taylor" snakehead design, that would be awesome! Straight pull on all the strings over the nut...and a beautiful design...taking away that bunched up look on the bass and treble E strings, especially on the GS with a 1 7/8" nut width. Last week I put new strings on the GS, winding the outside E strings on the opposite side. It is just an experiment, and it is a bit confusing tuning, going in and out of dropped D tuning. It does look better...just a bit weird. :)
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Hmmmm, braz and full ab binding.... I vote for more pics, all angles, in HD; purely for the sake of full disclosure, mind you.
:D
Edward
(http://i139.photobucket.com/albums/q298/Swablr/IMG_0732b_zpsddcf8af1.jpg) (http://i139.photobucket.com/albums/q298/Swablr/IMG_0742b_zps20cbc1bb.jpg)
OMG never give that one up! What a beauty!
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Herb-
That is one special-looking Taylor, and I'll bet that wood combo produces a stellar sound! Even though we're not talking about an NGD, I still must congratulate you on your recent choice to keep it!
God bless...
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I love the smiley bridge pin formation, too. Have any idea why Taylor switched it?
The smiley bridge pin formation was switched in 1998 or 1999, I believe. Taylor's reasoning, as a I recall was:
1. easier to mass produce a straight line of bridge pin holes, and
2. no appreciable advantage (soundwise) of the smiley bridge pin formation
...but it does look cool! I'm glad that I have that feature on my '95 and '97 below:
(http://i1198.photobucket.com/albums/aa445/abpurfling/Dorycloseupfront.jpg)
(http://i1198.photobucket.com/albums/aa445/abpurfling/Cujo-closeupfront.jpg)
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I love the smiley bridge pin formation, too. Have any idea why Taylor switched it?
The smiley bridge pin formation was switched in 1998 or 1999, I believe. Taylor's reasoning, as a I recall was:
1. easier to mass produce a straight line of bridge pin holes, and
2. no appreciable advantage (soundwise) of the smiley bridge pin formation
...but it does look cool! I'm glad that I have that feature on my '95 and '97 below:
When Cindy asked my about the smiley bridge, I thought she was referring to the abalone inlay. It didn't occur to me that she was referring to the pin arrangement.
I love the wide rosette of your '95 guitar. I believe the last year for that rosette style was 1996.
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Herb, what a beautiful specimen. I too love the curved bridge pin arrangement.
When I commissioned my build I specifically asked for the smiley bridge pin arrangement. It is actually better functionally as it reduces the tendency of the bridge to crack between holes because they are not on the same line as the grain.