First V Class Encounter

[Strumming Fool]

At my FLGS on Saturday, I had a chance to play a couple.  I didn't play the 814ce DLX only because I'm not a big rosewood fan. I did play the K14ce BE. While it represented lovely craftsmanship and smart design, its tone really disappointed me: minimal volume and thin, lifeless, dull tone. Perhaps, this was a bad example, but not forgivable based on its price tag. On the other hand, I played a 614ce V class that truly impressed with its warmth, bass response and expanded resonance to compliment maple's better characteristics of clarity and brilliance. As a standard production model, the 614 could be one's all-purpose guitar. I think that Andy hit a home run on this one!

Just my $.02

[mgap]

That is somewhat of a surprise to hear about the K24.  Not a surprise to hear about the 614ce. 
I did not think they were making a K24ce BE, only a K24ce with V class bracing, or are you thinking of the K14ce BE?

[Strumming Fool]

Thanks for correcting me - you're right - it was a K14ce BE. I'll fix the original post.

[timfitz63]

... I did play the K14ce BE. While it represented lovely craftsmanship and smart design, its tone really disappointed me: minimal volume and thin, lifeless, dull tone. Perhaps, this was a bad example, but not fogivable based on its price tag...

I think this is the Koa talking, "SF."  Compared to many other tonewoods (like Maple), as a rule Koa tends to have a much more, shall we say, 'subtle' voice.  There are exceptions, as always; but I personally find Koa tends to make a better-sounding finger-style guitar than a strumming guitar.  And the smaller the body, the better.

[Guitar Cowboy]

... I did play the K14ce BE. While it represented lovely craftsmanship and smart design, its tone really disappointed me: minimal volume and thin, lifeless, dull tone. Perhaps, this was a bad example, but not fogivable based on its price tag...

I think this is the Koa talking, "SF."  Compared to many other tonewoods (like Maple), as a rule Koa tends to have a much more, shall we say, 'subtle' voice.  There are exceptions, as always; but I personally find Koa tends to make a better-sounding finger-style guitar than a strumming guitar.  And the smaller the body, the better.

Hmm?... Except that  SF has two Koa's in his arsenal already and I have to assume that based on  his username that he does quite a bit of strumming . So I am curious, how do you use your two different Koa's and how would you characterize their differences? Could it just be that the K14  V class you tried had not had a chance to open up?.. especially when compared to the two that you already own  that have had a chance to open  considerably. 

[Strumming Fool]

... I did play the K14ce BE. While it represented lovely craftsmanship and smart design, its tone really disappointed me: minimal volume and thin, lifeless, dull tone. Perhaps, this was a bad example, but not fogivable based on its price tag...

I think this is the Koa talking, "SF."  Compared to many other tonewoods (like Maple), as a rule Koa tends to have a much more, shall we say, 'subtle' voice.  There are exceptions, as always; but I personally find Koa tends to make a better-sounding finger-style guitar than a strumming guitar.  And the smaller the body, the better.

I tend to agree with the general tonewood rules above. Having said that, I have two marvelous sounding Koa guitars at home. The '95 GA-Ks's tone of course has aged beautifully, but the 2014 koa top sounded great out of the box: sweet, balanced,brilliant tone from the get-go. I've played many of the newer ( 2014 and newer) Taylor koa guitars, which also had really nice sound. I hate to say this, but the K14 BE sounded like a very cheap guitar - just awful! But oh, that 614ce V-class was truly a revelation!

[Strumming Fool]

... I did play the K14ce BE. While it represented lovely craftsmanship and smart design, its tone really disappointed me: minimal volume and thin, lifeless, dull tone. Perhaps, this was a bad example, but not fogivable based on its price tag...

I think this is the Koa talking, "SF."  Compared to many other tonewoods (like Maple), as a rule Koa tends to have a much more, shall we say, 'subtle' voice.  There are exceptions, as always; but I personally find Koa tends to make a better-sounding finger-style guitar than a strumming guitar.  And the smaller the body, the better.

Hmm?... Except that  SF has two Koa's in his arsenal already and I have to assume that based on  his username that he does quite a bit of strumming . So I am curious, how do you use your two different Koa's and how would you characterize their differences? Could it just be that the K14  V class you tried had not had a chance to open up?.. especially when compared to the two that you already own  that have had a chance to open  considerably.

I am a picker/strummer, and I use this style with both my koa guitars. The '95 spruce top sounds very much like an old Martin spruce/mahogany dreadnought - very loud too! The '14 K24 is as described in my reply to Tim above  - sweet, balanced, brilliant with ample volume. It sounded pretty much that way when new, but all those characteristics have been enhanced with playing time.

Sorry to say, but this K14 BE just sounded plain bad.

[Frettingflyer]

I would have been surprised about the K14ce, but I had a similar experience with mine. I almost sent it back, but boy did it open up a few days later after more daily play, to where it has just an incredible sound that is a great complement to my 812ce 12fret. I was not looking to duplicate a sound profile and this adds nicely to the stable. Had it not opened up quickly it would have gone back. This one was not played though before I got it so it was a great experience to hear the change in the 1st hours of play.
That said, my 1st v-class try was a 914ce that was rather bleh, and as you said, at the price point you expect much more.

[timfitz63]

... I did play the K14ce BE. While it represented lovely craftsmanship and smart design, its tone really disappointed me: minimal volume and thin, lifeless, dull tone. Perhaps, this was a bad example, but not fogivable based on its price tag...

I think this is the Koa talking, "SF."  Compared to many other tonewoods (like Maple), as a rule Koa tends to have a much more, shall we say, 'subtle' voice.  There are exceptions, as always; but I personally find Koa tends to make a better-sounding finger-style guitar than a strumming guitar.  And the smaller the body, the better.

I tend to agree with the general tonewood rules above. Having said that, I have two marvelous sounding Koa guitars at home. The '95 GA-Ks's tone of course has aged beautifully, but the 2014 koa top sounded great out of the box: sweet, balanced,brilliant tone from the get-go. I've played many of the newer ( 2014 and newer) Taylor koa guitars, which also had really nice sound. I hate to say this, but the K14 BE sounded like a very cheap guitar - just awful! But oh, that 614ce V-class was truly a revelation!

I've also played Koa guitars that have had a much greater presence of voice -- and I own two of them myself, both basic K-Series models (a K24ce & K66ce).

But if the truth be told, I've also been somewhat underwhelmed by the tone/volume of the K14ce BE -- and that's after playing at least three different examples of the model.  Well, at least the line has been consistent...  I initially attributed that reaction to my prior experiences with Koa, which has been that the tone/volume produced by the wood is, well, undependable; I tend to pitch my tent with those of the opinion that one should play a Koa guitar before buying it...

Hmm?... Except that  SF has two Koa's in his arsenal already and I have to assume that based on his username that he does quite a bit of strumming... 

I wasn't trying to imply that Koa-based guitars sound bad when strummed; just that I think they often sound better when finger-picked.  Again, there are exceptions.

I would have been surprised about the K14ce, but I had a similar experience with mine. I almost sent it back, but boy did it open up a few days later after more daily play, to where it has just an incredible sound that is a great complement to my 812ce 12fret. I was not looking to duplicate a sound profile and this adds nicely to the stable. Had it not opened up quickly it would have gone back. This one was not played though before I got it so it was a great experience to hear the change in the 1st hours of play...

It's been said many times that Koa seems to open up differently than other tonewoods:  often more gradually, sometimes more abruptly.  Again, this characteristic tends to feed my opinion about its 'unpredictability.'  It's possible that Koa needs little more than patience and time for it to fully satisfy -- but it's a hard gamble when one is about to spend multiple thousands of dollars on a guitar that sounds a bit 'meek' in the store...

[AVTaylor83]

What sounded different about the V-Class 614ce compared to the previous one?

[Strumming Fool]

That I cannot say, because I had never played the revoiced 614. What I do know is that the current incarnation of the 614 is a very impressive guitar.

[ClassicRock]

Did we forget that the K14 BE has a torrified spruce top? Of course it will sound vastly different than a Koa topped guitar.

[Cliff_the_stiff]

Being new to DADGAD I thought that the V-class would be a great idea because of the intonation improvement. (I believe that I was right on that point)
Being very excited, I went out of my way to pick up a K-14 and loved the arm rest and beveled cutaway. I thought it sounded weak and tinny in the shop, but assumed that this was because the guitar I immediately played before it was a big spruce jumbo and I was happy the Taylor didn't have the high string buzz I get sometimes on factory set up Taylors I have tested, so was somewhat distracted by the beauty of the piece, and didn't focus on sound (error).
Once I got it home and realized the sound I was hearing was consistent with SF's assessment.

Without going through all of the details, I brought back the K-14, and at the end of the day ended up with a beautiful sounding 514ce Cedar top Mahogany back/sides.
I would put the 514 up against any Taylor I have ever played all the way to the 914ce for clarity and voice. Perfect combination of mids and trebles.
From what I have gathered, people don't really look to Taylor for a fat, warm,  room filling low end; rather we look to Taylor for that voice. You don't get much voice at all in that K-14.

[Strumming Fool]

Good choice! Taylor does cedar/mahogany better than almost everyone. In fact, I love the Taylor mahogany sound in general, having owned three of them: one with an Engelmann top, one with a European top and my current one with its bearclaw sitka top.

[mgap]

Without going through all of the details, I brought back the K-14, and at the end of the day ended up with a beautiful sounding 514ce Cedar top Mahogany back/sides.
I would put the 514 up against any Taylor I have ever played all the way to the 914ce for clarity and voice. Perfect combination of mids and trebles.
From what I have gathered, people don't really look to Taylor for a fat, warm,  room filling low end; rather we look to Taylor for that voice.

My oldest and still "one my favorite" guitars is my 2007 514ce.  Just a fantastic guitar.