Author Topic: Anyone install a Baggs Anthem to replace the ES or ES2?  (Read 11063 times)

Geosh

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Anyone install a Baggs Anthem to replace the ES or ES2?
« on: August 19, 2018, 11:36:18 PM »
I just picked up a 12-fret 412ce and love the guitar acoustically. It is perfect.

However, I still haven't bonded with the Expression System 2 and I just can't get it to sound how I want. We had a guy with a Larrivee OM with a Baggs Anthem play last night and it sounded fantastic with very little tweaking. I'm now temped to swap out and putt a Baggs system in my new Taylor. I'll likely keep the ES there too, just to fill the holes and allow the option of swapping back if I ever decide too.

Has anyone done this swap? I heard that Taylor was still drilling the bridge plates for a piezo even though they stopped using them. Still true? I'd be looking to do the install myself if possible to save some cash (and I'm pretty good with most work around a guitar) which I know will take some filing down of the saddle to compensate for the element thickness. Anything else I'd need to worry about? Will there be issues with having the ES2 pickups still installed against the saddle and possibly effecting the UST?

Thanks! Also, if you've made a switch let me know what you went with and if you were happy. I'm not trying to break the bank, so I was really looking at the Anthem SL. I play at church mostly and some small duo acoustic stuff occasionally.

Thanks!!

floyd80

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Re: Anyone install a Baggs Anthem to replace the ES or ES2?
« Reply #1 on: August 20, 2018, 12:30:29 PM »
I suggest you try some other options before installing a new system.  The ES 2 sounds great, but I found that using some pedals and EQ can really make it shine.  I run my 312/322 through a TC Helicon Voicelive 3, which has a "bodyrez" setting, that really makes it sound good.  That being said, the VL3 can be a pricey piece of gear, esp. if you're only going to use it for this option. TC helicon makes a small Bodyrez pedal that does the same thing.  Links below.  There are also other offereing from Zoom and Fishman that do the same thing.

TC Helicon Bodyrez pedal:
https://tinyurl.com/y72xxdrq

Fishman:
https://tinyurl.com/yd73jzfx

Zoom:
https://tinyurl.com/ycq35cc5

Geosh

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Re: Anyone install a Baggs Anthem to replace the ES or ES2?
« Reply #2 on: August 20, 2018, 02:53:10 PM »
I also have a Line 6 Helix that I can run it through that gives me all kinds of EQ and Impulse Response options. I’ve just never had to run through anything more than a DI (or a Baggs PADI with my old K&K equipped Taylor). I’ll be giving that a whirl next week in a live setting. Sounds ok at home but that doesn’t always translate 1:1.

I’m always up for trying a new EQ or pedal though instead of replacing pickups.

KimAC

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Re: Anyone install a Baggs Anthem to replace the ES or ES2?
« Reply #3 on: August 20, 2018, 03:28:37 PM »
Geosh:  'poss U should check out the Mi-Si Align XT (which includes NOT the Anthem but, rather, the Element....otherwise, tho, may JUST be the ticket, & less expensive that you might guess).....I copy/paste the following, good luck:  CONTENTS
• Align XT active battery-free preamplifier
• L.R. Baggs undersaddle pickup
• Power Charger
OVERVIEW
The Mi-Si Align XT is a direct replacement for the Taylor Expression System. It
features an active, battery-free preamp designed specifically to work with the L.R.
Baggs Element undersaddle acoustic guitar pickup. This enables Taylor fans to take
advantage of Mi-Si’s innovative battery-free technology.
The Align XT comes standard with volume and active bass and treble controls that
fit the exact spacing of your Taylor’s existing Expression preamp. You can also use
the same knobs from the Expression System, so the appearance of your instrument
remains unchanged.
The Align XT preamp uses Mi-Si’s custom piezo linearization scheme - allowing for
the most truthful and accurate sound from the pickup. The battery-free design is
a benefit for both the stage performer and the environment. All you have to do is
power up for 60 seconds using the Mi-Si Power Charger, providing you with up to 8
hours of performance time.
CAUTION
• Mi-Si strongly recommends professional installation of your Align XT pickup /
preamp system.
• Please read the installation instructions before proceeding.
• Mi-Si will not be responsible for any damage to your instrument or personal
injury resulting from installation, improper installation or any misuse of the
product.
• Use only the Power Charger provided with this package to power up this
product.
• Use of any other power supply or modification of an existing power supply may
cause permanent damage to the system and will not be covered under the
warranty.
PICKUP INSTALLATION
The Mi-Si Align XT System includes the L.R. Baggs Element Pickup. This flexible
under-saddle piezo pickup provides superb response and is easy to install.
Note: For optimum performance of the Element pickup, the bridge slot must
have a clean, flat surface free of any debris or over-spray from the finish.
The slot must be a minimum of .125” (1/8”) deep, but we suggest a depth of at least
.187” (3/16”) to avoid excessive saddle tilt.
Follow the 50/50 Rule: The amount of saddle visible above the bridge surface
(with the pickup installed) should be no greater than the amount of saddle in
the slot beneath the bridge surface; otherwise the balance and output of the
pickup may suffer.
Inspect the inside of the guitar and note the position of the braces and the pickup
in relation to the saddle slot. Drill at the end of the slot on the side that will enable
you to avoid all braces as you penetrate the top (FIGURE 4). Blow out the slot with
compressed air and check for remaining debris.
Important: Round out the inside of the hole where it meets the bottom of the
slot with a small, sharp knife or a small file to avoid pinching the pickup as the
saddle sits on it.
Mi-Si Align XT
www.mi-si.com
Extension
Drill Bit
Figure 1
Figure 2
Normal Saddle: Drill Floor
Figure 3
Short Saddle: Drill Side Wall
Jewelers’ Screwdriver
Slot
Bridge
Drill Bit
Guitar Top
Brace
Figure 4
This view depicts the bridge at an angle level with the guitar top and
perpendicular to the saddle slot. Note the rounded edge where the hole
has been drilled.
Figure 5
Proper saddle / pickup contact
(exaggerated saddle lean)

deiny

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Re: Anyone install a Baggs Anthem to replace the ES or ES2?
« Reply #4 on: August 28, 2018, 04:36:10 PM »
I have a 314ce and like you, I never liked the sound of ES2. Recently I decided to finally switch to LR Baggs Anthem (full version).
I can say that was the best thing I could have done. Finally I have the timbre of my guitar amplified naturally.

You can easily keep the original 9V battery compartment and connect to the Anthem pre-amp, and also use the existing hole for the output jack. I filled the bridge holes with plugs made of ebony by my luthier and the pre-amp holes with a product found at www.shawwoodshop.com.

If you are interested, I can post photos later on.

nhbiker1961

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Re: Anyone install a Baggs Anthem to replace the ES or ES2?
« Reply #5 on: August 29, 2018, 07:09:33 AM »
I have a 314ce and like you, I never liked the sound of ES2. Recently I decided to finally switch to LR Baggs Anthem (full version).
I can say that was the best thing I could have done. Finally I have the timbre of my guitar amplified naturally.

You can easily keep the original 9V battery compartment and connect to the Anthem pre-amp, and also use the existing hole for the output jack. I filled the bridge holes with plugs made of ebony by my luthier and the pre-amp holes with a product found at www.shawwoodshop.com.

If you are interested, I can post photos later on.

I would love to see pictures. I am thinking of doing the same thing.
Taylor 414ce
Taylor 214ce
2-Godin A6
Fender-strat
Fender-teli
Peavey
Washburn 12 String
Godin SD
Epiphone Red Dot
Wahburn dobro
Les Paul
Peavey Bass
2 Fender Basses
Acoustic bass.

deiny

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Re: Anyone install a Baggs Anthem to replace the ES or ES2?
« Reply #6 on: August 29, 2018, 08:41:45 AM »





Spinagio

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Re: Anyone install a Baggs Anthem to replace the ES or ES2?
« Reply #7 on: August 29, 2018, 03:13:53 PM »
I have an Anthem that I have used on very cheap guitars that when run through my Bose tonematch mixer, sound phenomenal (using the Taylor T5 setting). I couldn't wait to play my new 814ce through the same system and I almost cried it was so bad. It was embarrassing not to mention distracting. I tell my friends that my 814 is great on the sofa but sucks on the stage. I've heard it described as having a supermodel girlfriend who is a drunk that gets you thrown out of everywhere you go.
I've tried many things EQ wise but the best was to back off the center piezo of the E2.
'Back off' is poor wording. I have it so that it not touching the nut. You do this with a .050 allen wrench. The working theory is that these poles are fighting each other.
It's way better but you still get that finger and pick scratch and there is a ring, so I am thinking of putting my beloved Anthem in its 3rd guitar. What makes me want to do it more than ever is the news that I can used the same battery compartment and not have to patch that hole. The Anthem battery is a bag that you mount on a side wall. The Taylor battery compartment idea is a good one. I'm guessing you have to splice the wires to make this work; or is there another masterful stroke used?

deiny

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Re: Anyone install a Baggs Anthem to replace the ES or ES2?
« Reply #8 on: August 29, 2018, 03:27:40 PM »
I'm guessing you have to splice the wires to make this work;

Just cut off the Anthem battery connector and connect the wire to the Taylor battery box.
Very simple to do.




« Last Edit: August 29, 2018, 04:56:10 PM by deiny »

deiny

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Re: Anyone install a Baggs Anthem to replace the ES or ES2?
« Reply #9 on: August 29, 2018, 08:26:34 PM »
I'm guessing you have to splice the wires to make this work;

Just cut off the Anthem battery connector and connect the wire to the Taylor battery box.
Very simple to do.


Geosh

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Re: Anyone install a Baggs Anthem to replace the ES or ES2?
« Reply #10 on: August 30, 2018, 08:37:44 PM »
Thanks for the pics. I’m still trying to like the ES2 at the moment, but this just makes it all the more tempting to switch.

Thoughts on the Anthem SL vs the full version?

Spinagio

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Re: Anyone install a Baggs Anthem to replace the ES or ES2?
« Reply #11 on: August 31, 2018, 01:45:15 PM »
Thanks Deiny.
THe Anthem SL is cheaper in price but to adjust the tones betwix the piezo under the bridge nut sound and the mic  attached
 under the soundboard is a bit of a hassle. You need a small phillips screwdriver to make the adjustment. This best done by not mounting the soundhole volume/ adjusting screw thingy and then trying to get the tone between the two pickups that suit you. I have found that I tend to use more of the piezo sound as the mic sounds a bit boxy.  Also the placement of the mic is a trial and error thing as well but that would be with both types of Anthem. Both supply the sticky tape for mounting everything and keeping the wire secure and a velcro tape for the battery bag which you won't need using the Deiny method. And I believe that is what they are calling it. The Deiny Method.
And of course, I thought I had what I wanted and I was wrong after taking it on stage. To move the mic you have to remove the strings and to adjust the mix you can keep your strings in place and slip your phillips under the strings.
The top o de line Anthem has a wheel that lets you adjust it anytime you want. This soundhole mounted device is also much larger with more options.
Personally, after I got the tone mix I wanted there was no need for any more adjustments. I believe the difference in price is a C note at the time of this post.

Geosh

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Re: Anyone install a Baggs Anthem to replace the ES or ES2?
« Reply #12 on: September 09, 2018, 11:16:42 PM »
Ok, played out with the ES2 again and I can’t deal with this thing anymore. My buddies Martin with a K&K sounded hands down better than mine plugged in.

I’m now thinking that might be a cheap and easy upgrade for me, but will there be an issue installing the K&K with the holes in the bridge? I think they slightly overlap where the K&K sensors are bormally positioned.

Otherwise I’m going with the Anthem. I’ve just owned a K&K equipped Taylor before and got along well with it, and the Martin today just made me remember I liked it.