12 String with solid low end

[MB]

I agree with Jersey.  Breedlove 12's pack a wallop.  I've had two.  One, a jumbo, and currently a concert size.  Both walnut back n sides. Both loud on the bass side. I think they are known for it.

Thanks for the tip! I'm going to check them out!

[michaelw]

I'm not familiar with "lksm". What is that?

leo kottke signature model
http://www.taylorguitars.com/guitars/acoustic/leo-kottke-guitar

the audio may not be the greatest but
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=50EUzFhoynU
with mike gordon from phish
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fTh7DHIeJCM

just the guitar
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0oiRSB-WEBI

[MB]

Well... I know that the old 79 Guild F-512 that I have had the pleasure to own these last years has a ton of bottom end... but that is a given. I don't know which 12 string Ewan Dobson is playing here... but it has wonderful bottom end and he makes it sound awesome.. of course it does have a pickup in it....
http://youtu.be/g6aZydmmcws

Thanks for the link! That was an awesome performance!! He obviously had that thing tuned down in the neighborhood of C#?

[MB]

In the last few days I've seen a lot of very positive reviews on the Seagull Coastline S12 Cedar.
The price is sure right on these!
I have a Seagull S6 from 2001 that is perhaps the best playing guitar I have!

Has anyone played one of these?

[MB]

I'm not familiar with "lksm". What is that?

leo kottke signature model
http://www.taylorguitars.com/guitars/acoustic/leo-kottke-guitar

the audio may not be the greatest but
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=50EUzFhoynU
with mike gordon from phish
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fTh7DHIeJCM

just the guitar
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0oiRSB-WEBI

Thanks for clearing that up! I know I've heard of them before but for some reason the acronym threw me.
I'll check out the links...thank you!

[MexicoMike]

"In the last few days I've seen a lot of very positive reviews on the Seagull Coastline S12 Cedar."

That was my 2nd most recent 12 string!    I liked it well enough - it played very nicely and was well-balanced but it was quite reticent - didn't have sufficient volume for me.  Actually the seagull might have been pretty good if amplified but I wasn't doing that then.  I replaced it with a Guild and, OTOH, the Guild was all about volume.  It was LOUD and had too much in the midrange so that was yet another "not what I wanted" 12…    (There have been 6 of them so far…but the "modified" GS5 sounds good!)

[73171]

Maybe a Martin Grand J12-40E if you can find one...it's discontinued. It's a 17" super jumbo rosewood body with a spruce top. I've played the 6 string version of the same guitar and the bass is huge.

Another one to try would be a Martin D35s 12string. That's a 12-fret drednought 12 string.

[Earl]

I'll second the comments on the Seagulls.  I had a S6 based twelve string with a cedar top.  The cedar mellowed the "jangly" character of the twelve strings.  A bit sorry that I sold that one, but once I got a 354ltd Taylor 12, one was enough.

I also have a mahogany / cedar S6 six string that I use as my travel / beater guitar.  It is nice enough that I would hate to see anything happen to it, but I have only a couple of hundred bucks in it (bought used).

[Edward]

the lksm models were strung with mediums & tuned down to C#, which were the
jumbo body size, like the 355, but with mahogany back & sides, rather than sapele -
the bracing pattern on the lksm was a bit different, but the 355 can handle mediums at C#

I'm not familiar with "lksm". What is that?

"Leo Kotke Signature Model."  There are other "SMs" that is, signature models, out there.  The Kotke SM (both a 12 and a 6 string) was braced for and setup by the factory tuned down to C#.  Keep that in mind as changing gauges will, like any other guitar, likely change its voicing.

Edward

[etzeppy]

I have had more 12's than I care to count none of them had what I'd call good bass.  My current one is a Taylor GS5 that has acceptable bass with the following changes:  Remove the octave E and A strings (6th and 5th string) completely, change the current E and A lights to E and A mediums.  This results in a 10 string with pretty good bass response but you can overdrive it with hard playing and the bass tends to fade in the mix.  At light/medium playing it sounds pretty darned good.  If you play plugged in, you can boost the guitar volume as necessary without having to play hard.

I recently played a Taylor BTO that was a 9 string. They used the same concept, placing single strings on 4 - 6. I was impressed with how well it still captured the 12-string sound while keeping good bass response. I have yet to find a Taylor 12 string that I really like. I wish I could find a 12-string that sounded like a Guild jumbo and played like a Taylor. 

[MexicoMike]

"I wish I could find a 12-string that sounded like a Guild jumbo and played like a Taylor"

Any guitar can be adjusted to play exactly as you want it to.  Taylors are justifiably known to play well out of the box but there's no magic involved, It just requires a good setup.  So buy the Guild if you like the sound and modify the action height as needed.  I have never owned a guitar, including my two Taylors, that didn't need action work to suit my preference.  IMO, all guitars are supplied in "kit" form.  You have to adjust them to suit you.

[michaelw]

Any guitar can be adjusted to play exactly as you want it to.  Taylors are justifiably known to play well out of the box but there's no magic involved, It just requires a good setup.  So buy the Guild if you like the sound and modify the action height as needed.  I have never owned a guitar, including my two Taylors, that didn't need action work to suit my preference.  IMO, all guitars are supplied in "kit" form.  You have to adjust them to suit you.

depending on if the neck angle is correct, it should be possible to set up
most guitars to where the action is low & the fretting effort relatively easy -
if the guitar has a glued in or dovetail neck joint, there are ways to try to "get around" a neck reset
if the action is still too high to be comfortable & there is barely enough saddle height to maintain
adequate string break angle, such as sanding & reslotting the bridge & ramping the bridge pin holes,
provided the neck is not twisted or warped & if the top is not sinking near the fretboard extension

a Taylor NT neck differs a quite a bit from a conventional bolt on neck or a glued in neck joint, in that
the neck angle can be assessed, the strings slackened, bolts removed, the shim set changed out,
the neck bolted back on & the strings tuned back up to pitch in little more time than it takes to
remove the saddle, sand a little bit of the bottom, replace the saddle & retune, only to find out it needs
to be done again or, if the saddle was taken down a little too low, to put a shim in the saddle slot

Taylor's 12 string neck design, NT or preNT & neck block construction seems
to have bit more stability than many of the other 12 string guitars i've seen -
i have a 30 year old 12 string dreadnought that's doing just fine & i haven't
run across many other 12'ers that age to where the same can be said also

a friend had a seagull S6 six string & he literally wore that guitar out in a few
short years from playing it so much & he took excellent care of his guitars -
i've heard of changes in the la patrie/seagull neck joint design to where some
of the necks were epoxied to the body, making a neck reset all but impossible

on a 35 year old guild, i'd have a reputable luthier/repair tech to check it over to verify
that the neck angle & structural integrity of the guitar will not require any extensive, &
potentially expensive, repair work done, such as a neck reset, in the foreseeable future