Amplified or not?

[Captain Jim]

Like MexicoMike, I use a vocal harmonizer, TC Helicon Gtx; so I practice plugged in.  The harmonizer doesn't correct your pitch, so if you are off, so are the harmonies.  As Mike experienced, you have to understand how the harmonizer gets those notes.  One thing I have found while using this: I don't "slide" to a vocal note, because the harmonizer will do that as well... it can sound a bit demonic.  Same thing with bending notes on the guitar.  You can dial in the amount of effect (mainly reverb) and harmony; the Gtx sounds best (from my perspective) with the harmony set in approximately the 9:00 position, so that the harmony is not as loud as the melody vocal.

I run the guitar through the Gtx and out to an amp so I can make adjustments to the guitar without affecting vocals.  It still uses the guitar to determine how it will output the harmony.  If you are in a situation where you are running direct to a house PA, you can leave the amp at home if you want and use the Gtx to blend the amount of guitar and vocal to the PA, giving you some adjustment in sound.  Or, leave the amp in the chain, run the vocal out from the Gtx to the second channel on the amp and then run a direct line out from the amp - this allows you some control of the tone of both the guitar and vocal, AND lets you use your amp as a monitor (I use a Fishman Loudbox Mini).

People are fascinated by the harmonizer, and will often get closer to see if someone else is signing with me.     The harmonies add a nice variety... try playing some Beatles, Eagles, or Everly Brothers songs with and without the harmony - the addition of the harmonies of your own vocals is a big plus.

My "back up singers" are able to keep up with any changes I make on the fly. 

Best wishes,
Captain Jim

[MexicoMike]

Yes, totally agree with Jim's comments re using the harmonizer as far as vocal slides/other quirks, etc.

I have had several people ask if I had "prerecorded" the harmony tracks and they are usually quite intrigued to learn that the machine just "figures it out." 

Tonight I'm doing a gig and, for a couple of "tribute" songs that I didn't originally plan to do tonight, the harmonizer will be providing the other Everly Brother! 

[TaylorMate]

Yes, totally agree with Jim's comments re using the harmonizer as far as vocal slides/other quirks, etc.

I have had several people ask if I had "prerecorded" the harmony tracks and they are usually quite intrigued to learn that the machine just "figures it out." 

Tonight I'm doing a gig and, for a couple of "tribute" songs that I didn't originally plan to do tonight, the harmonizer will be providing the other Everly Brother! 

Mike, I am really grateful for the trouble you took to give me such extensive answers. And Captain Jim thank you for sharing your concurrent opinion. I now have a pretty good picture of what the Vocalist Live 3 can do for me - including its restrictions and your advice to work on my songs with this device. A minute ago I put my Boss VE-20 for sale on the Dutch version of E-bay. I am definitely going to try the VL3.

Toytoytoy tonight, Mike! With Phil 'in the box' 

[CodeBlueEMT]

 Not. I like the electronics for easy tuning.

[TaylorMate]

I have had several people ask if I had "prerecorded" the harmony tracks and they are usually quite intrigued to learn that the machine just "figures it out." 

MexicoMike, I think you changed my musical life (wellll, Karel, don't exagerate ). This afternoon I came back from my music store (in The Hague) with the Digitech VL3, after I sold my Boss VE-20 yesterday (over night) for a neat price. Boy, what a world of difference in userfriendliness. I installed the VL3 and could start singing instantly any of my songs, without the horrific and often unsuccesful tweaking which was needed on my VE-20. Super! I noted that playing single notes in stead of chords is something you have to anticipate upon, but I am sure I'll find my way. By playing full chords it's just a piece of cake to have the VL3 produce real good and quite natural hamonies.

[MexicoMike]

Great!  Glad you like the unit and happy I was able to provide some useful info.

[Marc]

I prefer to amlify by using my DPA 4099 microphone, but that isn't allways a practical option, that's when my new ES system and the Fishman Aura SPectrum DI comes in.

[MB]

I know everyone is different and has a different sound in their heads regarding what they think their acoustic guitar sound should be.
Reading thru these posts is somewhat confusing for me though. All the extra pre-amps and harmonizers etc just seem to be incredibly complicated and unnecessary. Perhaps I'm just getting old but when I plug one of my Taylor acoustics into a Bose L1 or a similar PA system, it sounds just like it should....an acoustic guitar. You can hear the tone woods working together thru an instrument that was crafted to sound a certain way. I have a lot invested in these Taylor acoustics and they do sound and play great! So to buy an electronic box to alter that sound and make it sound like something else seems to defeat the purpose of playing a fine instrument like a Taylor. I played a gig the other night....plugged straight into the Bose T1/L1 and I got many compliments on the sound of the guitar. I had just a touch of reverb dialed in thru the Bose T1 but that was it. It sounded fantastic! I cannot imagine paying for a box to alter that sound. I mean no disrespect to those who do this, I just don't understand it myself. If you are going to run an acoustic thru a modeler, why not just buy a cheap guitar? Am I the only one?

[Marc]

I totally agree on the modeler& imaging, MB.
For me though, bringing my own DI/EQ is a way to make sure I can tell the "sound engineer" to have flat settings, and to be able to compensate venue-specific sound problems.
My guitars/mic's/pickups can deliver the sound, but the venue doesn't allways accept it.
There's an EQ with presets on your Bose system as well, isn't there? Don't you use that to get the best sound for the venue you play?
(I seriously want that system ....)

[MexicoMike]

I have a Bose T1 and although I have messed with it a bit (present from my wife) and think it's a nice unit, I have never actually used it at a gig.   I use the Digitech harmonizer and it also acts as the "mixer" for the guitar and voice.  Since it also can add reverb/delay and a couple of other effects I haven't found any reason to use the T1 and add another component/set of cables.

So the only things I carry to a gig is a gig bag with the guitar and the harmonizer.  I regularly try out the T1 again at home but I keep coming up with no benefit to adding an extra piece of gear/cables.  Obviously it depends on what the performer is doing.

One thing I have been fooling with is a "porch board" floor bass.  If I decide to start using it, I would incorporate the T1 because I would need the input.  However, since the harmonizer has 3 foot switches, I don't think I'm mentally/physically capable of keeping a bass beat going while punching the harmonizer switches as necessary AND actually playing/singing.   

If I didn't use the harmonizer, I wouldn't plug the guitar in, I'd use a mic.

I don't know how those one-man-band guys manage!

[MB]

Hey Mexico-
I run a Porchboard too and it works really nice in the duo gig I'm doing.
Thru the Bose T1/L1 system it adds a pulse and drives a song along without being overbearing.
For example, on Folsom Prison Blues, it adds that bounce and works great with the alternating bass notes.

Are you using a Bose L1 system?
If so, the T1 would replace the harmonizer. I would not use both either.

[Captain Jim]

Hey Mexico-
I run a Porchboard too and it works really nice in the duo gig I'm doing.
Thru the Bose T1/L1 system it adds a pulse and drives a song along without being overbearing.
For example, on Folsom Prison Blues, it adds that bounce and works great with the alternating bass notes.

Are you using a Bose L1 system?
If so, the T1 would replace the harmonizer. I would not use both either.

The T1 can give you vocal harmonies?  I use a Bose L1 Compact, and use a harmonizer (and a Fishman Loudbox Mini with a direct line to the Bose) instead of a T1.  Either the harmonizer or the Mini gives me adjustment on the reverb (can do a different amount for the vocal and the guitar).

For those who haven't tried a harmonizer, think: Eagles, the Beatles, the Everly Brothers, etc, etc.  It adds another dimension for solo work.

Best wishes,
Jim

[MexicoMike]

Are you using a Bose L1 system?
If so, the T1 would replace the harmonizer. I would not use both either.

I have a Bose L1 compact but normally I use the house PA wherever.  I've only used the L1C once at a gig.  I like it but since I don't really need it for gigs, it's my "practice" setup at home.

Though I occasionally do "pure" acoustic gigs, no amplification at all, the harmonizer is now a very important part of my normal gigging.  If the T1 could generate vocal harmonies, I'd leave the digitech at home and use the bose.   Seems like since the T1 is basically just a computer, the capability to harmonize like the Digitech could be added.  But maybe not - I'm no software engineer so I really have no idea.

[MexicoMike]

MB - You inspired me…

Today I got out the Porchboard and, for the first time, seriously did some practicing using it and the harmonizer.  After some work I got some fair coordination going between the Pboard, the harmonizer and singing/playing.  In fact, I think I'm making sufficient progress to try the PB for one song at a gig on Tuesday!  I think I'll do Ricky Nelson's "Hello Mary Lou."  It sounds good with just one harmonizer "kick" needed and a straight rhythm on the PB and I believe - with more practice - I can get through it without getting crossed up…well, maybe. 

[TaylorMate]

I am using my Digitech harmonizer now since a week and although I am still experimenting it is an amazing thing. Start to like my own singing The guitar gets right through to my AER. Works fine, with only a Boss chorus pedal for some of my songs in between (and my K&K XRL preamp).

By the way, Mike, finger style is no problem indeed as long as you steer the harmonizer here and there with a soft touch of full chords. And you were right, needs a little change in technique, but I love to play with that.