Author Topic: Taylor ES system issues on all the new 2012's  (Read 11961 times)

Herb Hunter

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Re: Taylor ES system issues on all the new 2012's
« Reply #30 on: November 26, 2012, 06:46:10 PM »
In all fairness, I did play a beautiful new T-5 at the closest Guitar Center to us last month... great action, perfect in appearance, but a pickup/switch problem with that new guitar had two positions on the switch non-functional.  I was appalled that the salesman in that store knew there was a problem with the guitar, but rather than get it fixed, they left it hanging on the wall... up out of reach for all but the tallest.  The T-5 is kinda like the ES, but no other new Taylor that I tried had any issue with the ES.  Well, there was one that I couldn't get a sound out of at a different Guitar Center... but, it didn't have a 9v battery in it.   ::)  Not really a Taylor problem.


The Expression System doesn't use the pickup switch found on the T5. It is my understanding, and I haven't verified it recently, that the T5 pickup switch is made in Germany.

Yes, I am aware of that.  The pickup on the T-5, however does use 3 different pickups (along the lines of the ES)... close as I could come to being personally aware of ANY pickup problem on a 2012 Taylor, but specifically pointing out that this particular Guitar Center put it out for sale, knowing there was a problem.  To me that says something about the dealer as opposed to the manufacturer.

My apologies if I implied in any way that the T-5 pickup/switch set up is the same thing as an ES system.  I'll go sit in the corner for a while.  ;) 



While the T5 uses one soundboard pickup like those found on the Expression System, the point I was making was that the problem you found with the T5 on display was due to a faulty switch which the Expression System doesn't have so I saw little relevance to the alleged ES problems mentioned in the opening post.


Nevertheless, your account of the salesman knowingly displaying a new guitar in need of repair was both interesting and troubling and I understand your reason for mentioning it so thanks for posting about it.
« Last Edit: November 26, 2012, 06:48:05 PM by Herb Hunter »

michaelw

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Re: Taylor ES system issues on all the new 2012's
« Reply #31 on: November 27, 2012, 06:11:36 PM »
the neck sensor, body sensor & bass/treble/volume controls are ES-derived

position 1 is the neck & body sensor & position 2 is the neck sensor only -
these are the most 'acoustic' tones

if the issue was in switch position 3 thru 5, then the top humbucker is involved

if the 5 way switch is from the same source as the SB switches, then it's from schaller

in terms of the hardware, there's more than 50% ES there, Jim -
just wondering which switch positions had a concern
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Captain Jim

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Re: Taylor ES system issues on all the new 2012's
« Reply #32 on: November 27, 2012, 07:47:56 PM »
the neck sensor, body sensor & bass/treble/volume controls are ES-derived

position 1 is the neck & body sensor & position 2 is the neck sensor only -
these are the most 'acoustic' tones

if the issue was in switch position 3 thru 5, then the top humbucker is involved

if the 5 way switch is from the same source as the SB switches, then it's from schaller

in terms of the hardware, there's more than 50% ES there, Jim -
just wondering which switch positions had a concern


If I remember correctly, it was positions 3 and 5 that were getting no sound.  I figured it was a pickup problem rather than the switch, but I didn't pursue the issue.  I did play a very nice 814ce at the same time, which prompted my purchase of the one from Guitar Rodeo that was calling my name from afar.  ;)  The ES system on that 814 worked great... as does mine.  As did every other Taylor I played in the last month, leading up to my purchase.  8)

Again, I just mentioned the T-5 having a problem to point out the dealer issue.
2014 Taylor 522ce 12-fret
2012 Taylor 814ce
2006 Taylor T-5
2011 Taylor GSmini
2013 Rainsong Shorty SG-FLE
Gibson ES-335-TDC (1965)
Bose L1 Compact
Roland Cube-ST
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American Red

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Re: Taylor ES system issues on all the new 2012's
« Reply #33 on: November 27, 2012, 08:11:18 PM »
And in all fairness, the OP was only talking about the new 2012 taylor guitars.
So, I will take back the statement "that the average Taylor guitar owner on this forum has purchased over three Taylors.
That statement does not hold water for most of us, as quite a few Taylor guitars are now more than 11 monts old.

But 70% total failure is a big hook to swallow.

When you order guitars, you order a mix of different models and you do not get sequential serial numbers, so this would have been a random sampling.
Well outside of the normal bell curve.
To get this type of isolated, one time shipment failure would lead me to believe in either sabotage, or fabrication.

I do not believe that someone at Taylor had it in for this particular dealer.
There would have been a very limited number of employees that would have had access to pull and service the Guitar store's final order.

So,
What conclusions do you draw?

Taylor builds 450 Guitars a day.

This poor poster has probably seen more product failures than Taylor's Customer Service Department.
He should work for quality control.
He sure knows how to spot them...



 
« Last Edit: November 27, 2012, 08:17:46 PM by American Red »

Herb Hunter

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Re: Taylor ES system issues on all the new 2012's
« Reply #34 on: November 27, 2012, 08:15:25 PM »
the neck sensor, body sensor & bass/treble/volume controls are ES-derived

position 1 is the neck & body sensor & position 2 is the neck sensor only -
these are the most 'acoustic' tones

if the issue was in switch position 3 thru 5, then the top humbucker is involved

if the 5 way switch is from the same source as the SB switches, then it's from schaller

in terms of the hardware, there's more than 50% ES there, Jim -
just wondering which switch positions had a concern


If I remember correctly, it was positions 3 and 5 that were getting no sound.  I figured it was a pickup problem rather than the switch, but I didn't pursue the issue.  I did play a very nice 814ce at the same time, which prompted my purchase of the one from Guitar Rodeo that was calling my name from afar.  ;)  The ES system on that 814 worked great... as does mine.  As did every other Taylor I played in the last month, leading up to my purchase.  8)

Again, I just mentioned the T-5 having a problem to point out the dealer issue.


If positions 1,2 and 4 worked, then all all the pickups were probably operational so there is a higher likelihood that the switch was faulty.


Position 1: Neck humbucker and body sensor
Position 2: Neck humbucker only
Position 3: Bridge humbucker
Position 4: Neck and bridge humbuckers in parallel
Position 5: Neck and bridge in series

Captain Jim

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Re: Taylor ES system issues on all the new 2012's
« Reply #35 on: November 28, 2012, 12:02:57 AM »
Herb, you win.  I wouldn't know if it was the switch or one of the pickups, since I spent very little time with the guitar after plugging in and having it not work.  Not trying to be flip, but I don't care much, either.  SORRY I even mentioned it, at this point.  Forget whether it's the switch or the pickup; WHY would any dealer put out a guitar with a known issue?  THAT was the point of my post; not in ANY way questioning Taylor's quality control/the ES system/or any switch on any guitar ever made in the history of guitar making and/or switches.  My take on this whole thread is the OP has an agenda, since no one else seems to be aware of any widespread issue with the ES system.

Mods, feel free to yank this post if I have overstepped any being nice standard.  Or, call the ASPCA to protect this poor dead horse.  ::)

Respectfully (within reason),
Captain Jim
2014 Taylor 522ce 12-fret
2012 Taylor 814ce
2006 Taylor T-5
2011 Taylor GSmini
2013 Rainsong Shorty SG-FLE
Gibson ES-335-TDC (1965)
Bose L1 Compact
Roland Cube-ST
Fishman Loudbox Mini

Herb Hunter

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Re: Taylor ES system issues on all the new 2012's
« Reply #36 on: November 28, 2012, 08:09:54 AM »
Herb, you win.  I wouldn't know if it was the switch or one of the pickups, since I spent very little time with the guitar after plugging in and having it not work.  Not trying to be flip, but I don't care much, either.  SORRY I even mentioned it, at this point.  Forget whether it's the switch or the pickup; WHY would any dealer put out a guitar with a known issue?  THAT was the point of my post; not in ANY way questioning Taylor's quality control/the ES system/or any switch on any guitar ever made in the history of guitar making and/or switches.  My take on this whole thread is the OP has an agenda, since no one else seems to be aware of any widespread issue with the ES system.

Mods, feel free to yank this post if I have overstepped any being nice standard.  Or, call the ASPCA to protect this poor dead horse.  ::)

Respectfully (within reason),
Captain Jim


I don't consider that I won anything at all and certainly wasn't trying to play a game of one-upmanship. I was trying to be informative and regret that I caused you any distress. As i posted earlier, I'm glad you mentioned the case of a salesman knowingly displaying a faulty guitar.

Captain Jim

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Re: Taylor ES system issues on all the new 2012's
« Reply #37 on: November 28, 2012, 10:32:13 AM »
Distress?  ;D  I participate here for the fun of it.  I've learned a lot, exchanged some correspondence with like-minded folks, and enjoy a daily dose of "Taylor stuff" here.  In case anyone should think otherwise, I enjoy playing my guitars, but don't take that or myself too serious.  I think you missed the whole point of my first post in this thread, but admire your ability to diagnose pickup/switch problems.

I posted "you win," to let you know that this tangental drift adds nothing to the conversation... it was my non-aggressive way to let you know I was done.  I'm a married guy... not getting the last word is something with which I have familiarity.   ;)

Distress?  Seriously?   ;D 

Jim
2014 Taylor 522ce 12-fret
2012 Taylor 814ce
2006 Taylor T-5
2011 Taylor GSmini
2013 Rainsong Shorty SG-FLE
Gibson ES-335-TDC (1965)
Bose L1 Compact
Roland Cube-ST
Fishman Loudbox Mini

Herb Hunter

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Re: Taylor ES system issues on all the new 2012's
« Reply #38 on: November 28, 2012, 11:12:03 AM »
Distress?  ;D  I participate here for the fun of it.  I've learned a lot, exchanged some correspondence with like-minded folks, and enjoy a daily dose of "Taylor stuff" here.  In case anyone should think otherwise, I enjoy playing my guitars, but don't take that or myself too serious.  I think you missed the whole point of my first post in this thread, but admire your ability to diagnose pickup/switch problems.

I posted "you win," to let you know that this tangental drift adds nothing to the conversation... it was my non-aggressive way to let you know I was done.  I'm a married guy... not getting the last word is something with which I have familiarity.   ;)

Distress?  Seriously?   ;D 

Jim


Maybe a better word would have been, annoyance or vexation. Anyway, I regret your negative reaction to my well-meaning post.

Captain Jim

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Re: Taylor ES system issues on all the new 2012's
« Reply #39 on: November 28, 2012, 04:27:48 PM »
In all fairness, I did play a beautiful new T-5 at the closest Guitar Center to us last month... great action, perfect in appearance, but a pickup/switch problem with that new guitar had two positions on the switch non-functional.  I was appalled that the salesman in that store knew there was a problem with the guitar, but rather than get it fixed, they left it hanging on the wall... up out of reach for all but the tallest.  The T-5 is kinda like the ES, but no other new Taylor that I tried had any issue with the ES.  Well, there was one that I couldn't get a sound out of at a different Guitar Center... but, it didn't have a 9v battery in it.   ::)  Not really a Taylor problem.


The Expression System doesn't use the pickup switch found on the T5. It is my understanding, and I haven't verified it recently, that the T5 pickup switch is made in Germany.

Yes, I am aware of that.  The pickup on the T-5, however does use 3 different pickups (along the lines of the ES)... close as I could come to being personally aware of ANY pickup problem on a 2012 Taylor, but specifically pointing out that this particular Guitar Center put it out for sale, knowing there was a problem.  To me that says something about the dealer as opposed to the manufacturer.

My apologies if I implied in any way that the T-5 pickup/switch set up is the same thing as an ES system.  I'll go sit in the corner for a while.  ;) 



While the T5 uses one soundboard pickup like those found on the Expression System, the point I was making was that the problem you found with the T5 on display was due to a faulty switch which the Expression System doesn't have so I saw little relevance to the alleged ES problems mentioned in the opening post.


Nevertheless, your account of the salesman knowingly displaying a new guitar in need of repair was both interesting and troubling and I understand your reason for mentioning it so thanks for posting about it.

the neck sensor, body sensor & bass/treble/volume controls are ES-derived

position 1 is the neck & body sensor & position 2 is the neck sensor only -
these are the most 'acoustic' tones

if the issue was in switch position 3 thru 5, then the top humbucker is involved

if the 5 way switch is from the same source as the SB switches, then it's from schaller

in terms of the hardware, there's more than 50% ES there, Jim -
just wondering which switch positions had a concern


If I remember correctly, it was positions 3 and 5 that were getting no sound.  I figured it was a pickup problem rather than the switch, but I didn't pursue the issue.  I did play a very nice 814ce at the same time, which prompted my purchase of the one from Guitar Rodeo that was calling my name from afar.  ;)  The ES system on that 814 worked great... as does mine.  As did every other Taylor I played in the last month, leading up to my purchase.  8)

Again, I just mentioned the T-5 having a problem to point out the dealer issue.


If positions 1,2 and 4 worked, then all all the pickups were probably operational so there is a higher likelihood that the switch was faulty.


Position 1: Neck humbucker and body sensor
Position 2: Neck humbucker only
Position 3: Bridge humbucker
Position 4: Neck and bridge humbuckers in parallel
Position 5: Neck and bridge in series


Distress?  ;D  I participate here for the fun of it.  I've learned a lot, exchanged some correspondence with like-minded folks, and enjoy a daily dose of "Taylor stuff" here.  In case anyone should think otherwise, I enjoy playing my guitars, but don't take that or myself too serious.  I think you missed the whole point of my first post in this thread, but admire your ability to diagnose pickup/switch problems.

I posted "you win," to let you know that this tangental drift adds nothing to the conversation... it was my non-aggressive way to let you know I was done.  I'm a married guy... not getting the last word is something with which I have familiarity.   ;)

Distress?  Seriously?   ;D 

Jim


Maybe a better word would have been, annoyance or vexation. Anyway, I regret your negative reaction to my well-meaning post.

Neither annoyed nor vexed, Herb (and how often does one get to use the word 'vexed'?).  And, by definition, one can only regret one's own actions, not those of someone else.  Had it been a (as in: singular) post, I would have let it slide.  But, check out all those quotes above.  I think the whole thing is funny... in a 'Sheldon vs everyone else' kinda way (Big Bang Theory reference).

My apologies for coming across negative.  Posting multiple quotes does that to me, I guess.   ;)  (Note the winkie, I still think this is absurdly funny.)  If the intent of the original poster of this thread was to stir things up, it seems he has been somewhat successful.  I am not upset, annoyed, or any other negative term in regards to this (again) tangental discussion.  Should our paths cross, like at a "Find your Fit" event or any other guitar related occasion, I would be delighted to shake your hand and buy you the first cold one.  Feel free to post the last word - in the vernacular of the younger ones: put a fork in me, I'm done.   :)

Jim
2014 Taylor 522ce 12-fret
2012 Taylor 814ce
2006 Taylor T-5
2011 Taylor GSmini
2013 Rainsong Shorty SG-FLE
Gibson ES-335-TDC (1965)
Bose L1 Compact
Roland Cube-ST
Fishman Loudbox Mini

Picker 'n Grinner

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Re: Taylor ES system issues on all the new 2012's
« Reply #40 on: December 03, 2012, 10:14:45 PM »
The little electrons need love too ... Plug the amp into the wall.
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American Red

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Re: Taylor ES system issues on all the new 2012's
« Reply #41 on: December 04, 2012, 12:42:23 AM »
The little electrons need love too ... Plug the amp into the wall.

Now, that is funny!!!!


dcopper

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Re: Taylor ES system issues on all the new 2012's
« Reply #42 on: December 21, 2012, 01:10:42 PM »
In my recent quest to upgrade/change all my gear, over the last year, I have played at least 50 2012 Taylors with ES (a conservative estimate) , in all series including the Fall LTD PS14. I own three 2012 ES equipped Taylors. NOT ONE had an ES issue.
None of my ES equipped Taylors have ever failed on me, even the early versions (although I did not like the early ES tone).
Of the three T5s I have owned (now down to 2), the 5 way switch gets dirty and needs to get blown out and cleaned but it too has never failed since the T5 hit the market.
Just my experience.
davidc
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