Unofficial Taylor Guitar Forum - UTGF
The Lounge => The Lounge => Topic started by: Knight on May 07, 2017, 09:18:24 AM
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Other than for your own pleasure?
I just kinda stumbled into playing the guitar to keep my mind going. Writing my own music and figuring out which chords to use. Nothing great, entertaining myself.
I surf the internet a lot, finding that songwriting seem to be, well not a lot there. I did see a lot a contest for them, but look like money scam to me.
Seems to me there is no need for song writers, maybe since someone in a band writes music?
Not interested in becoming a song writter, just curious.
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A number of years ago, a young man, then a second year high school history teacher, came into my church office and asked me to listen to something. I did. He played piano and sang four songs for me, each one better than before, and none of which I'd ever heard. I asked where he got them, and he replied, "I wrote them." He did, but only in his head. At that time, he didn't know enough music theory to actually commit his songs to paper or even Finale. I asked what he wanted to do with his song writing, and he said that in his wildest dreams he'd love to be a professional songwriter, perhaps for one of the big publishers in Nashville. I recorded his songs, and made half a dozen copies. I gave them to him (now I wish I'd kept a copy!), together with
the contact info for a few folks in the business that I knew. One of them loved these songs, and a new star was born!
Lowell Alexander http://www.allmusic.com/artist/lowell-alexander-mn0000835829/credits went on from there to write a huge variety of songs for some very well known artists, such as Glenn Campbell, Point of Grace, Steve Green, Donny Osmond, Sandi Patty, Max Lucado, Selah, Margaret Becker, Natalie Grant, Travis Cottrell, the Gaither Vocal Band... Yes, most of these are Christian artists. He's also written musicals, and produced, directed, and played for countless recording projects. He has even taught courses in the fine art of songwriting, and has become of the industry's most sought after writers.
So, is there a need for songwriters today? Oh yes! It's not easy to earn a living at it, but with talent, drive, and a few connections, it can still be a dream come true!
cotten
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I have learned a life's lesson in the short time since I picked up the guitar, that no matter if you are a singer, artist, poet, etc.. If you are unable to share.
Well you feel unfulfilled. My wife is an artist and it never dawn on me how important it is to become involved in her works.
That without someone to share your songs, paintings ,poetry..... It can be an emotional drain
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I love writing then singing and playing my songs, because they are a form of prayer. God created me, and in His image, I create. I couldn't imagine doing otherwise. The rest of it (money, fame, whatever) are all on the fringe. It's that simple for me.
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So do the band's have someone in their band who writes their own music to play. Is that the normal situation?
I have yet to see anyone looking for songs or songwritters, except pay to enter contest.
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In the good old days, you would try to sell your songs to a publishing company, who in turn would try to find a fit with the right performing artist. Not sure what goes on these days...
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I have a friend of over 40 years in Nashville who is a well known songwriter. He holds the distinction of being the writer of one song on a Garth Brooks album where Garth wrote all the rest himself. His songs have been recorded by John Mellencamp, Diana Ross, Charlie Pride and John Denver to name a few. He complains all the time that songwriters get screwed on royalties. He gave an example of a John Denver concert in Russia that was televised to around a billion people. At those numbers, when John performed my buddy's song my friend was due in the neighborhood of $30,000.00 since the song was still new. He never saw a dime of it. He wrote a few published articles about digital downloading and how, beginning with the iTunes business model, songwriters are completely ripped off. He says there is no money in even being a successful songwriter anymore. That is unless you record your own songs and they go platinum!
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Songwriting is a passion, the success of which cannot be measured accurately in money. I'm willing to bet the greatest song ever written probably has never been played on the radio.
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Songwriting is a passion, the success of which cannot be measured accurately in money. I'm willing to bet the greatest song ever written probably has never been played on the radio.
Actually quite a few of Townes VanZandt's songs HAVE been on the radio and recorded by any number of well known artists.
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Songwriting is a passion, the success of which cannot be measured accurately in money. I'm willing to bet the greatest song ever written probably has never been played on the radio.
Amen to that! When money is involved, the songwriting process can become somewhat tainted. I have sold several songs that were written for the sole purpose of making money. They do not represent my best work. Motivation does matter.
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Songwriting is a passion, the success of which cannot be measured accurately in money. I'm willing to bet the greatest song ever written probably has never been played on the radio.
Amen to that! When money is involved, the songwriting process can become somewhat tainted. I have sold several songs that were written for the sole purpose of making money. They do not represent my best work. Motivation does matter.
Sorry y'all but I couldn't disagree more. There is a whole industry, long established, peopled with wordsmiths of immense talent like my friend in Nashville, wholeheartedly devoted to the artistic craft of songwriting. When they make money from a song charting it in no way taints their endeavors. If anything I would have to assume you are speaking from an amateur perspective as opposed to professional. Of course I don't personally know any of you or anything about you so please don't get butthurt by my observation. My friend has made a pro career going on 50 years of writing songs, along with another acquaintance of mine named Pete Wasner who penned almost every hit Vince Gill has had. The fact does remain however that nowadays you can pretty much forget making a living from it anymore due to digital downloading services that cut them out of the revenue stream. Just another area where tech has supplanted income for talented people. Carry on with your regular programming.
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Songwriting is a passion, the success of which cannot be measured accurately in money. I'm willing to bet the greatest song ever written probably has never been played on the radio.
Amen to that! When money is involved, the songwriting process can become somewhat tainted. I have sold several songs that were written for the sole purpose of making money. They do not represent my best work. Motivation does matter.
Sorry y'all but I couldn't disagree more. There is a whole industry, long established, peopled with wordsmiths of immense talent like my friend in Nashville, wholeheartedly devoted to the artistic craft of songwriting. When they make money from a song charting it in no way taints their endeavors. If anything I would have to assume you are speaking from an amateur perspective as opposed to professional. Of course I don't personally know any of you or anything about you so please don't get butthurt by my observation. My friend has made a pro career going on 50 years of writing songs, along with another acquaintance of mine named Pete Wasner who penned almost every hit Vince Gill has had. The fact does remain however that nowadays you can pretty much forget making a living from it anymore due to digital downloading services that cut them out of the revenue stream. Just another area where tech has supplanted income for talented people. Carry on with your regular programming.
Different people have different values - it's okay.
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Sorry y'all but I couldn't disagree more. There is a whole industry, long established, peopled with wordsmiths of immense talent like my friend in Nashville, wholeheartedly devoted to the artistic craft of songwriting. When they make money from a song charting it in no way taints their endeavors. If anything I would have to assume you are speaking from an amateur perspective as opposed to professional.
Well, there is more to songwriting than mere radio hits, but I'll grant you that there used to be an industry around pop hits, but I'm not sure it is a healthy, viable industry at this point.
Anecdotally, I ate lunch at a local Mexican food restaurant this past Saturday and they were playing current country hits over the sound system. Over the course of my meal, I heard 10 or 12 songs and every one of them was about 1) trucks, 2) cold beer, 3) getting drunk, 4) getting high, 5) a girl in a truck, or 6) some combination of the previous topics. And not only that, but the music for each of those songs was a slightly modified version of a rock or pop song from the 70's or 80's: one was essentially "In-A-Gadda-Da-Vida", one was an Aha! song, one was a Madonna song and several were slight variations on U2's "I Still Haven't Found What I'm Looking For".
At this point, the modern Nashville songwriting and arranging systems have found a way to make money (which is fine), but in the process have become a parody of what they once were.
Of course I don't personally know any of you or anything about you so please don't get butthurt by my observation.
For the most part, we're all adults here, so there's no need to speak to us like we are thirteen-year-olds. ;D
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Appreciate the input from my thread, but I am still wondering.... If you are an unknown band trying to make a name for yourself do you ..... write your own music ?
Or just play music by well known bands.
Basically who even needs songwriters now?
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If you're an unknown artist, one of the best ways to distinguish yourself is to find your own sound. You can play other artist's songs as a means of finding your strengths, but ultimately, playing original music will get you noticed if the songs are good. The 60s started a trend of artist/songwriters that still thrives today. Think Beatles, Bob Dylan or Simon and Garfunkel...they and others helped to blaze the trail from performers of songwriters tunes to performers of their own tunes. The hybrid would be a performer who covers another performer's song and puts a different spin on it. Does that make sense?
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At this point, the modern Nashville songwriting and arranging systems have found a way to make money (which is fine), but in the process have become a parody of what they once were.
Of course I don't personally know any of you or anything about you so please don't get butthurt by my observation.
For the most part, we're all adults here, so there's no need to speak to us like we are thirteen-year-olds. ;D
Formulaic hit songs have become the norm in almost every genre of music wouldn't you agree? It is what we have ascended to with corporate song creation factories and computer software programs that create "music". I can't think of a rock song in the past 25 years that sticks in my head like countless ones from the 70s still do! Of course my tastes harken back to when individuals wrote songs and worked out their own arrangements with their band, and visionary producers. As for contemporary country, don't even get me started as I totally agree with you. I'm reminded of a meme I saw recently that was a pic of George Strait saying "Luke Bryan? Never heard of her". Even the stage antics of current country performers leaves me wanting far less.
As to your second comment about me speaking to you as children, I'm at a total loss as to how you perceived that as my intent. Possibly because the term butthurt is one I lifted from my grandkids current vocabulary? I don't know. I can assure you it was the farthest thing from my intent. As I said, I don't know any of you personally, and particularly nothing about you. This reminds me of how on another guitar forum I traded comments with a guy several times discussing country music (I was always in agreement with him). I even went out and found the exact guitar to buy he recommended. When I asked him about his current career path he posted a pic of himself as being Shania Twain's guitarist! As far as I know, on this thread here at UTGF I could've been replying to an incredibly successful songwriter. In any case, please accept my heartfelt apology for any offense you might have felt from my comment. I'm still learning the culture here!
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Formulaic hit songs have become the norm in almost every genre of music wouldn't you agree? It is what we have ascended to with corporate song creation factories and computer software programs that create "music". I can't think of a rock song in the past 25 years that sticks in my head like countless ones from the 70s still do! Of course my tastes harken back to when individuals wrote songs and worked out their own arrangements with their band, and visionary producers. As for contemporary country, don't even get me started as I totally agree with you. I'm reminded of a meme I saw recently that was a pic of George Strait saying "Luke Bryan? Never heard of her". Even the stage antics of current country performers leaves me wanting far less.
I'm definitely in agreement with you there.
As to your second comment about me speaking to you as children, I'm at a total loss as to how you perceived that as my intent. Possibly because the term butthurt is one I lifted from my grandkids current vocabulary? I don't know. I can assure you it was the farthest thing from my intent. As I said, I don't know any of you personally, and particularly nothing about you. This reminds me of how on another guitar forum I traded comments with a guy several times discussing country music (I was always in agreement with him). I even went out and found the exact guitar to buy he recommended. When I asked him about his current career path he posted a pic of himself as being Shania Twain's guitarist! As far as I know, on this thread here at UTGF I could've been replying to an incredibly successful songwriter. In any case, please accept my heartfelt apology for any offense you might have felt from my comment. I'm still learning the culture here!
I intended my comment as good natured ribbing (hence the smiley) because that term is common among teenagers today. I took no offense from your comment nor was any intended by mine.
My apologies if the joking nature of my comment didn't come through in print.
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From the responds I am understanding that:
1. You form a band, perform music well known by the group of people listening so they feel comfortable listening to music they recognize performed by artist they like
2. Later as your band progresses, the music is twisted, tuned to the bands style but still remaining familiar to the audiences. They still recognize the music but realize the band has changed up the song. This enables the band to baby step into their own style with hopes of retaining fan base
3. When your band has become recognized then out of necessity you need to perform original music that your band members either write or are purchased.