Unofficial Taylor Guitar Forum - UTGF
Taylor Acoustic & Electric Guitars => Taylor Acoustic & Electric Guitars => Topic started by: not darth on December 12, 2011, 05:18:53 PM
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I'm thinking about the next guitar (hey, aren't we all?) and one version I've heard good things about are the 12-fret guitars, that is, those where the neck/body junction is at the 12th rather than the traditionally 14th fret.
Tell me about your 12-fretter, why did you opt for that? Do you also have a cutaway? Are you primarily a fingerstylist, flatpicker or a strummer?
Do you have any regrets or dislikes about that size?
How about some pix? :D
I'm just a noob, but I lean toward fingerstyle, and some of the guitars I've got my eye on are the GA5/514 and GA7/714 flavors, as well as the Seagull Artist Mosaic Folk CW and the Seagull Artist Peppino d'Agostino model.
Thanks!
:)
-K
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I don't have one, but Taylor's 12 fret all hog LTD GC is a wonderful guitar. If I was to ever get a 12 fretter, that would be the one I would hunt down. It was a fingerpicking machine, and still sounded amazing when strummed. I had never even considered a 12 fret (or a GC for all that matters) until I came across one of those. Just my opinion based on playing one once.
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There have been few things I've ever been as enthused about as I am my 12-fret. I had heard about them, played one at my local shop, and was just blown away by the sound. With the bridge moved toward the center of the lower bout, it is (as Bob Taylor has observed) like the difference between striking a drum toward the edge and striking it in the center. I bought a GC-size 12-fret, and I'm just blown away by the richness of the tone, the volume, and the enhanced bottom end. It's like the love child of a Taylor and a Martin, having inherited the best qualities of both.
When I got mine a few months ago, Taylor didn't offer a a closed headstock -- now they do. Wish I had one. Aside from that, with sinker redwood over cocobolo, the guitar is perfect.
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This is my first post! Thanks for the new Forum!
I became interested the the 12 fret guitars because of the very different "Taylor" sound that was coming from those guitars. After 3 or 4 road shows I finally convinced myself that I was indeed hearing a difference. After owning one since April (Spring Limited 12 fret ga
Cedar/Macassar) I have also found them much easier to play. I am beginning to have some "Arthur" gently creep everywhere in my body, and I find it just a little easier on all reaches of my hands and arms. My current feelings are that if I purchase another guitar that it will only be a 12 fret due to the reasons listed above.
Hope that helps!
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Ordered one of the first 12 frets from Taylor but came in as a mistake without the cutaway and did not feel comfortable but have decided a koa 12 fret will be my next Taylor purchase...with cutaway.
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one feature that i found that was different on a Taylor 12-fret than those
made by other builders is that the overall body shape remains the same -
the bridge is moved lower on the top, further away from the soundhole & the bracing
pattern altered to allow for the change in the bridge position, rather than having the
body elongated in order for the shoulders of the upper bouts to meet at the 12 fret
the grand auditorium was offered as 12 fret LTD as well, in Fall 10 &
i would love to see/hear the difference in a 12fret DN or GS,
should Taylor decide to make them available in the future
sorry to hear that they omitted the cutaway on your guitar, dkoloff -
just wondering when you opened the case & saw it, was your reponse something like
"uhh, umm ... i think there a little too much wood here ??? "
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Very interesting responses, I think I need to go try a 12-fret somewhere.
Looks like Jim at GR has one of the cedar/macassar spring ltd's in stock, but I have a feeling that if I go look at it I'm going to fall for it, which is probably not the best idea right now.
Of course, I do have two kidneys, hmmmmmm...... ;)
-K
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My 12 fret Koa is on it's way to a wonderful new home as we speak. I really like the tone of the 12 fret and the short scale, but I began playing a bit more capoing (is that a word?) up to the 4th or 5th fret and the 12 fret just got a little too cramped for me to play comfortably. I'm a big guy to begin with at 6'2" and 240# so I'm sure the issue is more me than the guitar. For fingerstyle they are wonderful and I'm sure I will have another at some point in the future.
Cheers,
Mark
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I've played several in stores, but don't own a 12-fret. I really like the playability of the short scale, and the warmer fuller tone. If I had not purchased my BTO GC, I would have purchased a 12-fret wit a cutaway.
I'm not a fan of the slotted head stocks, but at a Taylor event, the rep said that it is done for tonal reasons on the 12-fret models. Something about greater break angle over the nut.
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Very interesting responses, I think I need to go try a 12-fret somewhere.
Looks like Jim at GR has one of the cedar/macassar spring ltd's in stock, but I have a feeling that if I go look at it I'm going to fall for it, which is probably not the best idea right now.
Of course, I do have two kidneys, hmmmmmm...... ;)
-K
Who needs two kidneys anyway. I bet Jim would love for you to go and give his Ltd a play! ;)
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Well I've finally found my way over hear. Looks like a fantastic place. I'm currently 5 weeks into a Taylor 12 fret BTO wait. Edgeburst Sinker top with Cocobolo back/sides and ebony binding. Standard headstock, bone nut & saddle, and Gotoh gold tuners. Hopefully the holidays will make time move faster. Jim at Guitar Rodeo was fantastic to work with and (knock on wood) I should see it arrive on the 15th of January. I was looking for something a little bit different with this guitar and from the standard 12 frets that I have played in the stores I was really surprised at the sound that came out of this little monster. I think Dennis's love child comment really best describes the tone that I was hearing. Anyway another 5 to 6 weeks and then I can show some pictures.
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Well I've finally found my way over hear. Looks like a fantastic place. I'm currently 5 weeks into a Taylor 12 fret BTO wait. Edgeburst Sinker top with Cocobolo back/sides and ebony binding. Standard headstock, bone nut & saddle, and Gotoh gold tuners. Hopefully the holidays will make time move faster. Jim at Guitar Rodeo was fantastic to work with and (knock on wood) I should see it arrive on the 15th of January. I was looking for something a little bit different with this guitar and from the standard 12 frets that I have played in the stores I was really surprised at the sound that came out of this little monster. I think Dennis's love child comment really best describes the tone that I was hearing. Anyway another 5 to 6 weeks and then I can show some pictures.
1. Welcome! :)
2. You must post pics when you get that ...wow, sounds like a stunner!
I played a 12-fret at a Road Show and was immediately impressed (I'm a natural cynic ;) ). I'm not even a "small guitar" kind of guy and never fancied Parlors or smaller shapes, personally. So I was merely curious, then immediately experienced what the "to do" was about. The 12-fret has a deeper more "mature" voice (hmmm, how to describe that??) that is simply different. And different enough that I got it in my head to search them out. So I tried a couple of GC body guitars ...no go for me. The did sound smaller for me, and was no where near the same. Yup, it was the build of a 12-fret that lends itself to "that" tone. FWIW, I am a strummer and picker, maybe round 5% with bare fingers. For the short time I had it in my hands, I would say it takes strumming very well, yet its smaller size and build made it nicely touch sensitive.
So I'd personally say hold out and get a 12-fret in your hands: you'll either want one immediately or feel blaise about it; it is a different guitar, to be sure! FWIW, I found an RT style 2 (that's a GC body) that filled that 12-fret sound in my head: short scale, deep tones, yet still big sounding despite it's diminutive size, and 14 frets for better access. RT is no longer taking orders, but if you find one used, I'd say jump on it. But at least with a 12 fret, you can order/spec one out to your liking. Happy hunting!
Edward
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When the Taylor 12 Frets first came out, I thought, eh, just another minor variation, maybe a nice to have eventually, or to try..
But I have been convinced otherwise now.. These are my FAVORITE models to play, especially for finger style ..
There is something very special about the tension, the tone, and the feel of them indeed..
I have GA and GC variations, and love em both..
Spend an hour in a shop playing one if you can.. It may totally surprise you!
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I haven't been able to play a 12 fret. From the posts that I've read here, I think I need to find one to try.
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I'm thinking about the next guitar (hey, aren't we all?) and one version I've heard good things about are the 12-fret guitars, that is, those where the neck/body junction is at the 12th rather than the traditionally 14th fret.
Tell me about your 12-fretter, why did you opt for that? Do you also have a cutaway? Are you primarily a fingerstylist, flatpicker or a strummer?
Do you have any regrets or dislikes about that size?
How about some pix? :D
I started out with a 412 a long time ago, then a '98 312 then stumbled on a Larrivee Forum IV all mahogany 12 fret. The sound of that Larrivee was pretty amazing and I falsely credited that difference in it being a 12 fret when actually it was due to the elongated shoulders the OO sized model has as well as the different bracing.
The Recording King OOO sized 12 fret I got afterwards had a similar tone as the Larrivee as it has the same elongated shoulders.
When I ordered the Taylor 12 I expected it to have the same crisp trebles my 312 has with simply more bass. It turned out that the Taylor 12 had a much richer bass and midtone, with slightly attenuated treble as well. That surprised and slightly disappointed me, but I've grown to like it very much. Because Taylor kept the same body design while dropping the bridge lower, the tone really didn't change as dramatically as I would have guessed. But the richer midrange tones along with the rosewood body makes for a very pleasing tone.
Having a cutaway is nice, but I wouldn't turn down a 12 fret I liked if it didn't have one. I don't play a capo much higher than the 5th fret so it's not a big issue playing that high up.
Having played the exact same body size for a few decades, of course it's very comfortable to me and the playability of a Taylor neck is simply unequaled. I play fingerstyle mostly, but it takes strumming well. It's kinda nice having your left hand a little closer in due to the shorter neck and it's also nice having a lighter headstock because so much wood is removed for the slots. People make a fuss about changing strings on these, but using broken off toothpicks makes tightening the strings in for the first time pretty easy.
If you'd like to hear mine, I have 4 Bob Dylan covers recorded with it. The bass runs turned out really nice using the Taylor 12.
Link is here: http://jpmist.blogspot.com/2011/10/my-back-pages.html
(http://db.tt/VvKml07l)
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i'll add my thoughts after having owned and currently still, some 12 fret instruments.
short history, i started with 14 fret guitars-knew nothing of the difference until about 6 months after starting some basic steel string classes and developed a hankering for the sound of nylon-Flamenco specifically.
i began-unknowingly to myself, a reduction of my 14 fret instruments about 2 years ago. I started working with a Weissenborn and just loved the simplicity of that fretboard-made a trade with a guy for his 12 fret Beneteau 000 and that was that. I was spoiled. The Beneteau had a cutaway-which i really like on a 12. A few factors weighed in over the following year and i ended up trading the Beneteau for a Goodall TR000(no cutaway). The Goodall had a 1 13/16" nut width and 2 1/4" saddle string spacing which is about perfect for me. Along this time i developed a desire for the Taylor 2010 12 fret 814 after a friend had purchased one and sung its praises(he never had been a taylor fan so i knew it had to be good)-i was lucky Jim at GR still had one left and i acquired it quickly.
The Goodall is simply a monster. Loud, easy to play, beautiful tone, perfect everything except no cutaway-i missed that. The 814 12f i really enjoyed but since both were sitka/EIR i sold the 814 to fund something(i think it was some home repair). A while back i picked up a very nice GC 12 fret in the sitka/EIR because i really missed that 814 12 and none were to be found. The GC was a fine instrument. I do prefer the GA size and lately just found out i really like the GS body size. So after some thought i traded the GC for a GT6 Baritone(which is best described as a shock to ones system :P).
The things that really stood out for me with the Taylor 12's:
1)the tone-they brought me back, i had left taylor a few years back and went to Martins and some luthier built instruments because of the yearning for a different tone. . In my absence, taylor had made changes to braces, special routing, and other things.
2)the shortscale is very nice and easy to play-keep in mind the distance between the frets get a little tight as you go up the neck
3)the taylor neck and build quality-no use to expound on the superlative feel and nature of the taylor neck profile/design or build quality-its simply top shelf and stand above the water line with a few others IMO. typically excellent intonation and setup from the factory-all you do is spend an hour at most fine tuning to suit your style of play.
I need to add that the original reason i drifted towards 12 fret guitars in the first place was the fact of the whole neck being a little closer to ones body and you have less reach for the lower frets. i have a left thumb injury that is permanent. Most standard scale instruments cause discomfort within minutes and i found myself fighting the instrument. I started with standard scale 12 frets and over time migrated to shortscale. The Taylor 12 fret design felt easy to play with absolutely no discomfort and the tone was smoother/less jangly than how i perceived taylors of the past.
some of my hero's who play 12 frets-and do it quite well, are Peter Rowan and Martin Simpson. I play primarily fingerstyle with little strumming, no nails. I will emphasize the Goodall TR000 in sitka/EIR is a monster with a pick and strums fine. The 814 12 fret was a good strummer as well-i never tried the GC 12-just didn't think to do it.
in an odd turn of events i've recently found myself back into standard scale taylors-and with the Baritone a 27" scale. I find these ,so far, very easy to play with a nice low setup(and i'm liking medium gauge strings-always was light gauge in the past). And my left hand is not giving me the least issues. so what is written in stone today is gravel tomorrow :Pi suppose.
If i were to have another Taylor 12 fret, i would prefer the GA size(it played very easy for me sitting) and would LOVE if Taylor offered a 1 13/16" nut width or wider, and standard taylor scale length. And i think a GS 12 fret could be a stomper as well. The Goodall is a 25" scale and for me that is the perfect length between short and standard scale for my particular body size and playing style.
I've owned slotheads and paddleheads in all sorts of instruments-neither design comes into play for me when i am contemplating purchase-i've personally never paid attention to consider any tonal difference-string changes are no more difficult on slotheads than for paddlehead-just different. same for a cutaway, i've never paid attention and would prefer one versus not having one on a 12(it definitely makes playing up the neck more smooth and fun......and easy)
sorry for such a long post, but a nice 12 fret deserves it.
d