Unofficial Taylor Guitar Forum - UTGF
Taylor Acoustic & Electric Guitars => Taylor Acoustic & Electric Guitars => Topic started by: raa2173 on May 06, 2014, 12:11:50 AM
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Hi!
I am new to the forum. Was part of an old Taylor forum (14 years ago). Previously had a 714 but sold it because I couldn't get used to the size. I love the Martin 000's btw and have tried a few Taylor grand concerts myself. I am returning to the Taylor fold and would very much like your suggestion regarding my next grand concert purchase (would certainly get it with electronics and a cutaway).
I was dead set on a 14-fret GC, but then I've been reading all this craze about 12 frets and how they increase the bass and midrange.
However, there are no 12-fret GC's in my area so I can't really demo to see if they "feel" different from the 14-fret models.
Before I take the plunge, I would just like to ask if there are any drawbacks to getting a 12-fret. Would you feel cramped while playing it because of the short neck? Would you lose the famous Taylor "brightness" if you go 12-fret?
Thank you!
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The Taylor GC 12-fret is less bright and less Taylor-like/more Martin-like as compared with the 14 fret model. Both have the identical short scale length with the 12-fret having its bridge placed lower on the lower bout; this placement gives the GC 12-fret its distinctive tone. Of course playing up the neck is a bit more restrictive with the 12-fret, but that is of concern only if you would order a non-cutaway model. Get the 12-fret if you prefer a richer, prematurely vintage sounding instrument. I love mine.
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Having your hand ~2" closer does take some getting used to, but I go between my short-scale 12 fret Taylor and my 14 fret 25.5" Lowden now with no major issues. On either guitar, if I'm going to be playing a lot way up the neck, I switch to my left knee. Both are cutaways.
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My 12-fret BTO was a dream to play from Day 1 and it's the guitar I play 90 percent of the time. If you're going to play way up the neck, I'd recommend a cutaway.
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It's hard for me to recommend that you buy without trying. But I think you'll be more pleased with a 12-fret GC than the normal 14-fret. I have owned three variations on a mahogany GC; all were/are exceptional instruments but to my ear the 12-fret is the best.
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Thanks all!
I dropped by a store today and fortunately, it both had a 12-fret and 14-fret GC in stock. Side by side, the 12-fret sounded fuller/better. However, the 14 fret was more comfortable for me. The shortness of the neck of the 12-fret oftentimes left my left wrist at a "weird" angle when playing basic chords. Must be because of my relatively long arms. (did anybody experience this?)
Although the 12-fret's sound was a dream, I think I'm more inclined to go 14-fret, due to ergonomic reasons. Again, thanks to those who gave advice on the 12-fret and I'm just sad it apparently did not work out for me.
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I had a similar experience. I found the 14 fret more comfortable for me and more in line with what I was used to. Both versions of the GC are great options. I also wanted the normal fret pattern for playing fingerstyle up the neck. You have to go with what meets your desires and feels best to you. You aren't sacrificing by going with the 14 fret IMHO. Good luck.
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I had a similar experience. I found the 14 fret more comfortable for me and more in line with what I was used to. Both versions of the GC are great options. I also wanted the normal fret pattern for playing fingerstyle up the neck. You have to go with what meets your desires and feels best to you. You aren't sacrificing by going with the 14 fret IMHO. Good luck.
I agree with Taylor Girl. I have owned a 712ce and it was very nice. I have owned a 814ce 12th fret and I could not get on with the balance of the whole guitar. It was very uncomfortable. On the other hand the 712ce 25.5" scale was a dream. I for one don't think you will be sacrificing any tone or comfort by going with a 14th fret.
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I'm going to respectfully disagree with those who say you aren't sacrificing anything by going with the 14-fret. I own both 14s and 12s, and I think you'll be sacrificing a sizable amount of tone. But if you find the 12-fret not to your liking from a comfort standpoint, that's a different issue. For me, a 12-fret is even more comfortable than a 14. To each his or her own.
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Thanks all!
I dropped by a store today and fortunately, it both had a 12-fret and 14-fret GC in stock. Side by side, the 12-fret sounded fuller/better. However, the 14 fret was more comfortable for me. The shortness of the neck of the 12-fret oftentimes left my left wrist at a "weird" angle when playing basic chords. Must be because of my relatively long arms. (did anybody experience this?)
Although the 12-fret's sound was a dream, I think I'm more inclined to go 14-fret, due to ergonomic reasons. Again, thanks to those who gave advice on the 12-fret and I'm just sad it apparently did not work out for me.
If you find the right wood combination in a GC 14-fret, the tone will not disappoint. For example, I owned a Taylor GC7 a few years back. It had a cedar top with rosewood back and sides. The tone was very rich and satisfying, in part due to the shorter scale (nut to saddle measurement on all current 14-fret GCs). For me, the shorter scale also worked against me, because while comfortable, it couldn't stand up to some of my more aggressive strumming. My advise would be to try as many 14 fret GCs as possible in different tone woods to determine which works best for you. If you're a fingerstylist, the cedar/rosewood combo should work quite well for you.
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My advise would be to try as many 14 fret GCs as possible in different tone woods to determine which works best for you.
Another good point.
The tonewoods will be a personal thing.....see what sounds best to you with your playing style.
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Thanks all!
I dropped by a store today and fortunately, it both had a 12-fret and 14-fret GC in stock. Side by side, the 12-fret sounded fuller/better. However, the 14 fret was more comfortable for me. The shortness of the neck of the 12-fret oftentimes left my left wrist at a "weird" angle when playing basic chords. Must be because of my relatively long arms. (did anybody experience this?)
Although the 12-fret's sound was a dream, I think I'm more inclined to go 14-fret, due to ergonomic reasons. Again, thanks to those who gave advice on the 12-fret and I'm just sad it apparently did not work out for me.
that is best way to determine if something will work -
it's easy to get caught up in the info found on the internet & elsewhere,
but where the rubber meets the road is what is most comfortable for you
depending on the year model of 714 you owned (96-7s had standard sitka tops & had a CED designation for cedar),
a 712ce with cedar top (standard top on current models is sitka) would be the closest, in terms of wood combination,
but a 512ce mahogany, which comes standard with a cedar top, may be an easier in-stock model to find to try out
if you find that you need a little more headroom when strumming, there is a HP package available that has
adirondack bracing, bone nut & saddls & gotoh tuners, which would make for a nice combo on a 512ce, imho -
i haven't been able to try a 812ce yet, but if the last 814ce i tried is any indication of what might be possible,
a cedar top 812ce HP could be something worth checking into, although it'd likely be a special order & a bit %cey
good luck on your search & please keep us posted on what you try & what you like
have fun :)
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Ok, thank you so much for the tips guys! Will definitely give you a heads-up (and a picture) of what I ordered. But its certainly going to be a 14-fret short scale grand concert model. Just don't know the woods. Thinking of doing a BTO though...
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Ok, thank you so much for the tips guys! Will definitely give you a heads-up (and a picture) of what I ordered. But its certainly going to be a 14-fret short scale grand concert model. Just don't know the woods. Thinking of doing a BTO though...
Exciting! Let us know what you end up with...we love NGD's!
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Ok, thank you so much for the tips guys! Will definitely give you a heads-up (and a picture) of what I ordered. But its certainly going to be a 14-fret short scale grand concert model. Just don't know the woods. Thinking of doing a BTO though...
nice 8)
if you're comfortable with a deeper body (the X12 nylon models have a 4 5/8" X14 depth, rather than 4 3/8")
you may want to inquire if there is an "off-menu" option for a deep body steel string X12 (martin's OO-DB is 4 5/8" also)
http://www.ebay.com/itm/2012-Taylor-BTO-STUNNING-GC-Grand-Concert-Doyle-Dykes-Walnut-Venetian-Cutaway-/151113555372?pt=Guitar&hash=item232f11ddac (http://www.ebay.com/itm/2012-Taylor-BTO-STUNNING-GC-Grand-Concert-Doyle-Dykes-Walnut-Venetian-Cutaway-/151113555372?pt=Guitar&hash=item232f11ddac)
the 91 412 was a deep body & have been some others that were made during the same time period
http://www.ebay.com/itm/TAYLOR-CUSTOM-912-DEEP-BODY-BRAZILIAN-ROSEWOOD-CONCERT-GUITAR-ACOUSTIC-ELE-/171318127182?pt=Guitar&hash=item27e35b2a4e&nma=true&si=AOombJXsEhU6a7LPv9huAWKDWA4%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/TAYLOR-CUSTOM-912-DEEP-BODY-BRAZILIAN-ROSEWOOD-CONCERT-GUITAR-ACOUSTIC-ELE-/171318127182?pt=Guitar&hash=item27e35b2a4e&nma=true&si=AOombJXsEhU6a7LPv9huAWKDWA4%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557)
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Ok, thank you so much for the tips guys! Will definitely give you a heads-up (and a picture) of what I ordered. But its certainly going to be a 14-fret short scale grand concert model. Just don't know the woods. Thinking of doing a BTO though...
Not trying to change your mind here, but it really does take a while to get used to the 12-fret short scale geometry. I played my Custom 12-fret Mahogany GC on my left leg for quite a while to allow my arm to stretch out more. Now, I play it just like my Lowden, and feel no difference in comfort.
Why did I give so much time to feel comfortable with it? Because it's a TONE MONSTER, that's why. It is the sweetest, woodiest, mellowist guitar I've ever played. And it's nothing at all like my Lowden, so I appreciate the difference all the more, and can sound like two different guitarists playing different styled songs on different guitars.
I guess I'm schizophrenic. ;D
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Ok, thank you so much for the tips guys! Will definitely give you a heads-up (and a picture) of what I ordered. But its certainly going to be a 14-fret short scale grand concert model. Just don't know the woods. Thinking of doing a BTO though...
Not trying to change your mind here, but it really does take a while to get used to the 12-fret short scale geometry. I played my Custom 12-fret Mahogany GC on my left leg for quite a while to allow my arm to stretch out more. Now, I play it just like my Lowden, and feel no difference in comfort.
Why did I give so much time to feel comfortable with it? Because it's a TONE MONSTER, that's why. It is the sweetest, woodiest, mellowist guitar I've ever played. And it's nothing at all like my Lowden, so I appreciate the difference all the more, and can sound like two different guitarists playing different styled songs on different guitars.
I guess I'm schizophrenic. ;D
There is the other reason you have a tone master M19, the beautiful wood combo., Yes, mahogany top and mahogany back and sides.
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Agreed that the tops difference is very important. I think the move of the bridge down with the 12-fret design "leverages" the mahogany top to maximize the sweetness.
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Ok, thank you so much for the tips guys! Will definitely give you a heads-up (and a picture) of what I ordered. But its certainly going to be a 14-fret short scale grand concert model. Just don't know the woods. Thinking of doing a BTO though...
If you do a BTO, you have a lot of great wood and bracing options at your disposal to get you the sound you're looking for...have fun with your quest!
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Hi All!
A bit of an update on my grand concert purchase. I finally took the plunge on a BTO Koa. Always been fascinated by that wood ever since Taylor came up with the Kenny Loggins and Richie Sambora signature models. I read somewhere that Koa is kind of a gamble in terms of tone; its fairly inconsistent. However, I thought that I should get it over with especially considering that koa guitars with "good figuring" is hard to come by these days (the regular production Koa series are starting to look like mahogany guitars).
Anyway, from my testing of a K24ce, I love the bright sound of the guitar (over my Eng/IRW 714) and I heard that the low-end response of koa will improve over time. Ordered through Lincoln of Randee's Music, Chicago. He's a real pleasure to deal with. Here are the specs:
Grand Concert w/ Venetian Cutaway
14-fret, short-scale
AA-Koa Top
AA-Koa Back and Sides
Adirondack CV Bracing
Ebony Binding
White Fiber Purfling
Paua Single Rosette w/ bound soundhole
Tropical Vine Inlays
Standard headstock with koa headstock veneer
Mother of Pearl Taylor Logo
Gotoh 510 gold tuners
Gloss body, natural finish
Satin neck
Here are the Koa sets for the top and back/sides that I chose:
Topwood:
(http://i1257.photobucket.com/albums/ii505/bembi_a/KoaWoodSet53Top_zps78099b8d.jpg)[/URL]
Back/Sides:
(http://i1257.photobucket.com/albums/ii505/bembi_a/KoaWoodSet50BackandSides_zps6d954c6a.jpg)[/URL]
Again, thank you for your suggestions. Let me know what you think!
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Wow....she's going to be beautiful. Sapwood is cool! Looking forward to seeing the completed masterpiece.
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... Let me know what you think!
:o
i think :o
the wood set & the appointments :o
the single ring paua rosette & ebony bound soundhole - R Taylor "vibe"
tropical vine inlay - my fave out of all of the inlays used on the Taylor koa series ( 04 L7)
(http://www.elderly.com/new_instruments/items/images/20N/K14CEL7_inlays.jpg)
adi CV & gotohs - sweet :)
i think i mentioned :o
very nice 8)
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Great specs! I believe you'll be very happy with the sound, especially with the Adi CV bracing. I've heard some very impressive all-koa Taylors in recent years, and the common denominator was that bracing. I'm so excited for you!
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Man, that sounds like an awesome guitar! Love your choices and the wood looks spectacular. Congrats. :)
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Thanks all! I am truly excited about the guitar. I requested my dealer to ask the Taylor rep to pick good AA koa woods, I was emailed a couple of sets and I chose the "wildest" koa wood set for me. As for the Adirondack CV bracing, I truly concur that it may make the all-koa guitar sound better. I heard that the top vibrates more with Adirondack CV bracing (hence, it could offset the perceived stiffness of the Koa topwood).
Not trying to be off-tangent, but I always (try) to give names to my guitars and such names usually immediately come off the top of my head (rather instinctively). For example, I call my Fender Custom Shop Strat (with the wildest flame maple neck you can ever imagine) "Barnie" - after my favorite Shih Tzu dog.
I have yet to think of a name for this lovely guitar but I guess I have 2 months to do so... What's the name of your Taylor? :D
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i could possibly see naming this one barney
http://www.mylespaul.com/forums/1979666-post1.html (http://www.mylespaul.com/forums/1979666-post1.html)
or kermit
http://www.acousticguitarforum.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2390677&postcount=11 (http://www.acousticguitarforum.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2390677&postcount=11)
grover
http://img17.shop-pro.jp/PA01149/270/product/43629378.jpg?20130907005156 (http://img17.shop-pro.jp/PA01149/270/product/43629378.jpg?20130907005156)
elmo
http://briansguitars.com/product/used-taylor-presentation-ps-ltd-quilt-maple-ruby-red (http://briansguitars.com/product/used-taylor-presentation-ps-ltd-quilt-maple-ruby-red)
miss piggy ???
http://www.taylorguitars.com/guitars/acoustic/528 (http://www.taylorguitars.com/guitars/acoustic/528)
richie, kenny, john or jake ;)
http://www.taylorguitars.com/guitars/acoustic/k24ce (http://www.taylorguitars.com/guitars/acoustic/k24ce)