Looks like the new 500s missed out

[All Together]

Feels like a slap in the face.

Taylor has no problem using Advanced Performance bracing on the 500 limiteds they released:

http://www.acousticguitarforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=420863

Yet for the standard 2016 500 series, they only use Performance Bracing as opposed to Advanced Performance bracing.

I know they are a big business, and that they hired that new marketing woman. But it would be really great if they just gave consumers the best guitars they could build - I really don't think using Advanced Performance bracing is going to cost their CNC machines more than Performance bracing, just like how CV bracing doesn't cost more than Standard II bracing.

It's really frustrating when you actually like the tone of Taylor guitars, but have no other choice but to buy another brand that has no issue with offering torrefied tops for any series, or the bracing that you want, whereas with Taylor their BTO program will not allow you to choose torrefied tops (other than Sitka for 600), and also will not let you choose Advanced Performance bracing.

It's like they want you to fit into their cookie cutter mould of buying what they offer, and if you want Advanced Performance you have to buy an 800, because Rosewood is more "higher end" than Mahogany.

[tedtan]

Taylor has used a number of different bracing patterns over the years and none are "better" than the others, they just sound a bit different from one another. What works best for a guitar with mahogany back and sides may well be different than what works best for a guitar with its back and sides made of a different material. And you wouldn't even know which pattern you personally prefer with mahogany, for example, unless you had the opportunity to play several guitars with each bracing pattern to develop an informed opinion.

So I wouldn't get worked up about this. The AP bracing isn't better, only slightly different, so there is nothing to worry about missing out on.

[Earl]

This was my first reaction too.  I could not describe the tonal differences of the various bracing patterns or what they are intended to do.  Most of my Taylor guitars (except the bartione 416) are 2010 or older, so maybe I only have the original bracing?  The whole thing strikes me as marketing-speak, kinda like having a Ford Escort LX instead of a regular plain Escort.

I always judge individual guitars on sound first, then playability, and consider the specs later.  And there is variation among examples of the same model due to wood variability that are probably greater than the bracing pattern accounts for anyway.

[azslacker]

Thanks Earl, and tedtan. Been grinding on me all day trying to word it and say the same thing.

[guitarsrsoawesome]

I'm pretty sure my 2013 514ce (cedar topped) has Standard II bracing and is phenomenal sounding, at least to my ear.  Maybe the Performance Bracing worked better not only with Mahogany but across the three tops offered, Lutz spruce, hog and cedar tops?

[Strumming Fool]

I'm pretty sure my 2013 514ce (cedar topped) has Standard II bracing and is phenomenal sounding, at least to my ear.  Maybe the Performance Bracing worked better not only with Mahogany but across the three tops offered, Lutz spruce, hog and cedar tops?

My 2013 FLTD 514e (European spruce/ Flamed Mahogany) has Adirondack CV bracing, which sounds great. Prior to this, I owned a 2001 514e (Engelmann spruce/ Mahogany) that had standard (for that year) bracing and also sounded great. As others have said, it's the individual guitar's impact on you that counts. If you like it, buy it. If you don't, find the one that speaks to you (Taylor or other brand) and buy it.

[wooglins]

I think the only difference between them is the side braces.

[guitarsrsoawesome]

I'm pretty sure my 2013 514ce (cedar topped) has Standard II bracing and is phenomenal sounding, at least to my ear.  Maybe the Performance Bracing worked better not only with Mahogany but across the three tops offered, Lutz spruce, hog and cedar tops?

My 2013 FLTD 514e (European spruce/ Flamed Mahogany) has Adirondack CV bracing, which sounds great. Prior to this, I owned a 2001 514e (Engelmann spruce/ Mahogany) that had standard (for that year) bracing and also sounded great. As others have said, it's the individual guitar's impact on you that counts. If you like it, buy it. If you don't, find the one that speaks to you (Taylor or other brand) and buy it.

This strand is a bit of a revisit of the strand we had on your BTO with a cedar top...the Standard II was/is perfect in this case...but I wouldn't know personally how the Performance Bracing would change anything.  I always imagine the new bracing is even thinner than before and allows for more movement of the top.  It's just hard to imagine my 514 louder when it seems so loud already...

[Strumming Fool]

You're right. The new bracing could change the sound you currently love to something you might not love as much. Each individual guitar as the sum of its parts should be judged on its own unique merits.

[ntotoro]

Advanced Performance bracing may turn a 'hog guitar into something that doesn't sound as appealing as it does on a rosewood guitar. It could be just simple as that. Same goes for CV bracing. I have to be honest... my 2013 Fall LTD 516e ('hog/Euro spruce top/Adi CV bracing) doesn't sound light years different than my 2000 514ce ('hog/Engelmann top/whatever bracing was used standard in 2000), it just sounds a big bigger and more bassy. A lot of that can be attributed to the difference in body size.

Using my Martins as an example, I have a 000-18 with scalloped Golden-Era bracing, but the bottom tone bar is only 1/4" and the top is shaved a little thinner than standard. It still sounds the same family as a "standard" 000-18, but just a little different. Whether it's better is up to the player.

Nick

[michaelw]

Advanced Performance bracing may turn a 'hog guitar into something that doesn't sound as appealing...

+1

the guitar in the link doesn't look like curly mahogany to me -
it looks more like blackwood
http://www.musiciansfriend.com/guitars/taylor-limited-edition-516e-grand-symphony-with-arm-rest-acoustic-electric-guitar

there are variances in rosewood & maple bracing patterns,
even though they are both listed as being 'advanced performance' -
to me, it matters little what the written specs are,
but the real kicker is how the guitar actually sounds

i'm not one that has to have the latest version as soon as
it comes out, but if the latest iteration shows to have real benefit
over the previous one, then i'll give it serious consideration -
until i get a chance to put my paws on a 2016 516ce with lutz top,
i'm not too concerned whether or not it's 'missing out' on anything

there was this model also, that was released before the armrest LTD
http://www.musiciansfriend.com/guitars/taylor-fall-2013-edition-516e-grand-symphony-acoustic-electric-guitar

for me, if the current 500s have a favorable tonal response
that fill a niche that is a different interpretation of the pre-anything
spruce/mahogany Taylors that are presently in the arsenal, then
i would be inclined to consider pulling the trigger, but until then ...

[ntotoro]

That second link is the exact 516e that I have...

Figured hog, Euro spruce top with CV bracing and you know what? It still sounds like a mahogany Taylor GS.

Nick

[All Together]

I think the only difference between them is the side braces.

What's your source for that information?

the guitar in the link doesn't look like curly mahogany to me -
it looks more like blackwood

That somewhat changes things, I guess that AGF guy was trying to get away with passing it off as Mahogany as he calls it "curly Mahogany" in his advertisement.

[wooglins]

I think the only difference between them is the side braces.

What's your source for that information?

Me I owned one and took a peek with my mirror set.  Looks just like 6 and 8 series bracing minus side braces.

the guitar in the link doesn't look like curly mahogany to me -
it looks more like blackwood

That somewhat changes things, I guess that AGF guy was trying to get away with passing it off as Mahogany as he calls it "curly Mahogany" in his advertisement.

It is curley mahogany but not the most figured set I have ever seen
  Stunning guitar.

[All Together]

It is curley mahogany but not the most figured set I have ever seen
  Stunning guitar.

Well if it IS in fact Mahogany, then my point stands - that Advanced Performance bracing CAN be used on Mahogany, but Taylor have chosen NOT to put it on the 500 series.  This business strategy of Taylor is very unfortunate for people who want the best "Quality" guitars they can.  Now it seems like if you want a better guitar, you have to go up in the series.  If you want an Abalone rosette, if you want Advanced Performance, if you want these features, you can't get a 500, you have to get a limited or a Rosewood guitar.