Marketing vs. Improvements

[MB]

Congrats Dank! How do you like the GO body size?
I just got one too (528e) and just love it! Great low end but good balance too!
Enjoy that big ole box!

[dank]

I like the size. If it were my only acoustic, I would be happier with a smaller body, but fortunately, I have several acoustics to choose from. The GO is a great addition to my collection.

[AVTaylor83]

I got to play an 814FE today.  It was okay, I wouldn't say it is a huge improvement over the previous 814, in fact to be honest I felt like the old 814 was better because the old one had more shimmer and clarity. The new one is maybe better for digging in but the old one is better for relaxing strumming on a Sunday afternoon. The new one looked a lot better though. It didn't particularly make me want to get out my wallet but it was nice to be able to finally try it.

Yeah those were pretty much my thoughts as well.  I can see how it could be a good guitar for a straight-up hard strummer...but it lacked sweetness to my ears.  It sounded more 'airy'.  Almost like something I'd expect from mahogany.  However, doing an A/B test with my 2009 GA5, I found the 814 to be severely lacking with highs in comparison.  Both guitars had Elixir PB's on them.  Obviously the GA5 had less low end, but volume-wise I felt like both were comparable, with the GA5 sounding sweeter with more clarity.  I'm a light-medium strummer, so I'm sure that has something to do with it.  My playing style responds more to cedar.

But then I A/B'd the 814 with a 2013 816 that had Elixir 80/20's.  Again, the 816 sounded a lot clearer with more shimmer than the new 814.  And this was at GC, so the strings on this 'previous year' 816 were well overdue for changing.  When I strummed harder, the 814 sounded pretty muddy to my ears compared to my GA5 and the 816.  I didn't notice any more significant 'low end' than what I'd heard (and felt) from the previous 814.  I'd like to hear the new 814 with the HD Light 80/20's.  I'd also like to hear a pre 2014 CV 814 with those HD 80/20's as well.  I'm not a big fan of PB strings on rosewood guitars, so that was probably a factor.   It doesn't sound bad, it just doesn't sound great, certainly not enough for me to rush out and get one.

I don't fault Taylor for trying new things.  With the GS series, they've brought in a bunch of customers that probably wouldn't have tried a Taylor in the past.  With this new 800 series, they're probably trying to reach folks that want a combination of the Taylor sound and playability with the vintage sound of a Martin or Gibson.  I think this new 800 series does that, it's just not my ideal sound.  I don't want vintage.  The reason I started playing Taylors was due to their clarity and sparkle.  But the great thing about Taylor is that they have a track record of catering to their customers.  As long as I have the option to get a guitar with the previous bracings and no ES, I have no issue with them trying to market new things.  Just don't forget about those of us that loved your guitars for what they were prior to all the big changes of the past decade.  And so far they haven't, that's why I stay loyal to Taylor.

[milo_otis]

I got to play a new 2014 814ce this past Friday, but didn't get to spend much time with it and really only got to compare it to a 314ce. It sounded really good, both acoustically and through a Fishman Loudbox Artist. Compared to the 314ce (which sounded pretty lackluster vs. the 324s that I've played), it was just more lively, more responsive, more open and just felt lighter. (That was probably quite an unfair comparison.) Compared to the 714ce (in my memory, which is not a fair comparison either) it sounded a bit more open with slightly more present mids, slightly more present and spongy bass, but with slightly less overtone content and less shimmer. I liked it, but there was that trade off. To get a looser, more open sound, with open even mids, the treble has to be less articulate with fewer overtones?  I liked those overtones and zip of the 714ce and felt like I could dig in with those single note lines, but I liked the rounder bass and more present mids of the 814ce and automatically approached it with a more delicate touch. Did it come down to strings....all of those changes to bracing, glues, finish, etc.? I'm not sure.  I will say that with the revoicing, the changes in tone were perceivable, but subtle to me.

Over the past few months, I've realized that I really like the spruce/rosewood combo in the Grand Auditorium size (which I think is one of the perfect Taylor combos) and I can tell you that I instantly knew that I liked the 814ce (though not enough to break out my wallet), whereas the 714ce took a bit to grow on me.

Once again, all of this is an unfair comparison, but the important point is that I finally got to play the latest version of the 814ce and thought that it sounded very good. Given time and playing could a pre-2014 814ce sound like a 2014 814ce? Maybe. Would I run out and buy one? Not any time soon, since I really love what I have, but I got to see that different isn't better. Different seems to be a trade off and not necessarily better or worse, but different.

[jw3571]

It seems like every year something new and hot comes out, people rush out to buy the new hot thing, and then they end up selling for the next new hot thing?

[milo_otis]

It seems like every year something new and hot comes out, people rush out to buy the new hot thing, and then they end up selling for the next new hot thing?

It certainly does. That could be great for those people who are willing to wait a bit, since they can pick up a relatively unused item from an eager beaver wanting "the latest and greatest" selling at a used price....or even better, wait for the market to slow down and pick up last year's model or any NOS at a great blowout price. Of course, the best choice is to seek it out, get what you love and want in the first place, just hold on to it, play like today is your last and enjoy the journey!

[ntotoro]

It seems like every year something new and hot comes out, people rush out to buy the new hot thing, and then they end up selling for the next new hot thing?

I'm actually wondering how close an older 814ce will come to the tone of a new one if you put a set of Elixir HD Lights on it. Not discounting the other changes, obviously, just curious. The biggest change, I imagine, is when it's amplified.

Nick

[milo_otis]

It seems like every year something new and hot comes out, people rush out to buy the new hot thing, and then they end up selling for the next new hot thing?

I'm actually wondering how close an older 814ce will come to the tone of a new one if you put a set of Elixir HD Lights on it. Not discounting the other changes, obviously, just curious. The biggest change, I imagine, is when it's amplified.

Nick

That would be a great experiment for an owner of a pre-2014 814, that also happens to really like it, too. 

Maybe someone like MB is up for it!

[Gutch]

From 15 years of collecting and playing Taylors, I can tell you there is a big difference in tone in the Andy Powers designs compared to the earlier models.  I'm not saying better, because I love my older guitars.  However, the new designs bring a depth and complexity to the tone that wasn't there before.




IMO, it's not just marketing...

[DennisG]

However, the new designs bring a depth and complexity to the tone that wasn't there before.

IMO, it's not just marketing...

Completely agree.  Like it or not, the new 814 sounds significantly different (to my ears) from the pre-Andy Powers 814.

[Strumming Fool]

I've always respected the 814 for the value it provided, but I never really wanted one...then I played a '14 814 and concluded that I'd really like some of these features in a new BTO... Taylor, keep on striving for better and better guitars!

[Earl]

I was able to try a new 2014 810 for about 20 quiet minutes at my local shop yesterday.  It was quite nice, with a smooth and mellow tone more akin to my 24 year old Martin J-40 than my more recent Taylor guitars (all between 3-12 years old).  So I would say that this isn't just marketing hype, but there are real perceptible tonal differences and a different voice, sorta halfway between the classic Martin boomy tone and the more modern crisper Taylor tone.  I mostly played it out of curiosity, since this is the first 2014 model that I have been able to see and touch.  I am not ever going to seriously be in the market for a dreadnought again.  Now an 816 or an 814 might be a different question altogether....

The ebony fretboard was fairly mottled with lots of lighter areas in the ebony - maybe 35-40% total.  I could live with *some* lighter areas, but this one was busy enough to distract from the very nice 800-series inlays, and was IMO a bit much for a guitar at this price point.  I would expect a little less from the ebony on a 100 - 400 series fretboard.  I have seen smoky ebony fretboards that looks quite nice, but this wasn't one of them.

BTW, I am sure it had the new Elixir HD strings on it, since this one has only been in the showroom for a week or two.  I did not notice a major difference in terms of playing feel.  I may not be the best judge of these strings however, since I play mostly mediums these days, or medium-light bluegrass sets (medium gauge for the bass and lights for the trebles).  The HD's seem to be the inverse - mediums for the trebles and lights for the bass.

[michaelw]

unless the shop changed them, or for some reason ordered the guitar with a
non-standard set of strings the HD gauges are standard on the X12 & X14 -
the 810 (the one i played sounded exceptional to me), 816 & 818 models that i've tried
had mediums on them, which is meant to accentuate the qualities of those body shapes
http://www.taylorguitars.com/guitars/acoustic/810
http://www.taylorguitars.com/guitars/acoustic/816
http://www.taylorguitars.com/guitars/acoustic/818e

i've yet to try an X18 sitka/rosewood that is really to my ear, after trying 6 examples
(3 - 818, 2 - 718, 1 -  918), so mahogany is probably what i'm looking at in that body size -
i was kind of hoping a 810 deep body & 814ce 12 fret FE models with adi bracing would have
been made available, but hopefully the AP bracing & 3.5 finish will be Custom options next year

the phosphor bronze strings & micarta saddle have a perceivable effect on tone, imho, so a more
accurate comparison might be putting the same strings & saddle on the guitars being compared

[Christhee68]

Regarding Wood and Steel Magazine, I have been picking it up at my local guitar store for years and  I'd have to say it is 100% marketing hype AND it was 100% successful in getting me to buy a Taylor (314ce). With all the info on the NT neck, the details on construction, and all the different tips, tricks, and info in the magazine, I knew my next purchase would be a Taylor.

My grandfather was a bluegrass legend and I had always hoped to inherit one of his Martins. But, as a (semi-) professional musician, if was going to be laying out my own money for an instrument, it was going to be a Taylor.

That being said, I still wouldn't mind inheriting a Martin someday.

[mgap]

That being said, I still wouldn't mind inheriting a Martin someday.

Ditto