Unofficial Taylor Guitar Forum - UTGF
Taylor Acoustic & Electric Guitars => Taylor Acoustic & Electric Guitars => Topic started by: Guitarsan on October 12, 2022, 03:09:59 PM
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It had to happen sooner or later, and that time has come. Just received my last printed copy of Wood & Steel. They announce in the issue they're discontinuing it due to costs and sustainability and to focus on a richer multi-media experience in the digital version they introduced during the pandemic. They say they will continue to refine and innovate the digital version and you can subscribe to it to be notified when it comes out. A sad milestone.
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We knew it would come eventually. I'm surprised that hard copy lasted this long. I mostly enjoyed them, but some issues were getting hard to read (non-guitar content that was rather "preachy"). The crazy uncommanded scrolling of the web version is a real turnoff and makes it hard to read. I would prefer if they made a PDF version to download, as I have been doing for the past 18 months or so. At least then the pages turn only when *I* want them to, not when the window thinks it should.
I'll watch for this final printed copy and hang onto it. Mailed copies seem to take longer to get to Idaho than others here, so maybe in the next three weeks?
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Oh well. There goes my Taylor reading material. I refuse to read magazines like that online. I'm no luddite (I do a lot of I.T. work and other high level computing). Nope, not a good way to take in information (studies prove it) and I prefer to have Taylor only know they sent the mag, not when, where and how I'm reading it (highly likely as a digital product). I'm sad as I liked W&S but it's dead to me now.
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Yep, mine came today delivering the BAD news.
I will not be reading it online. I would be OK to pay a small subscription to continue the "dead tree" version.
Oh well......I will enjoy this one and that will be the end of it.
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It's a darn shame. I guess it's another casualty of the times we live in. I'm not going to say I won't read some of it digitally, but I will not be able to give it the same attention than the physical version.
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Agree with all the lament above! Likewise, I won’t be clicking on either. The printed format is perfect leisure material and a whole different vibe than net reads. Another casualty of the times is right! Yet another fallout of a garbage economy. Big bummer!
Edward
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As a former contributor to the magazine, this makes me sad. There's nothing like settling back, opening a copy of Wood & Steel, and reading about the world of Taylor guitars.
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I'm with the general consensus here. I can somewhat understand Taylor's decision to move to completely digital. I won't seek out the Wood & Steel online. I enjoyed sitting down and reading the print copy.....just not the same with a computer or tablet.
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One would hope (though this is the UNofficial Taylor Guitar Forum) that someone from Taylor actually sees this thread at some point and reverses this error. There was a lot of customer goodwill with that printed product and a little goodwill goes a long way. Naturally the reverse of that is that when you constantly give someone something they don't ever expect and then take it away there's a level of expectation created upon first receipt that continues to build over time. Of course that is, conversely once again, part of that goodwill I was referring to in the first part of this post.
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This is a sure cure for GAS, no more drooling over the latest offering.
:D Danny
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This is a sure cure for GAS, no more drooling over the latest offering.
:D Danny
Good point, Danny. Looking back, much of the GAS I've had for Taylor guitars over the last 25+ years has come from the quarterly issues of W&S. Almost every issue sent me to my local dealer to test drive something, out of curiosity. A fair percentage of those times, a guitar followed me home. Now there will be one less area of temptation. It was the last guitar-related print media that I received on a recurring basis.
In fairness, I just noticed that the 1st and 3rd issues for the past couple of years are downloadable as a PDF. While that is really not the same visual and tactile satisfaction as print, at least the format is actually readable unlike the web version. Look under the "see past issues" tab. https://woodandsteel.taylorguitars.com/product-spotlight/hands-on-learning/
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I just got my final issue, what a sad day. Like many here I really enjoyed checking out the new guitars and reading the articles. I don’t care for the online version. Reading on a tablet or computer is much less likely. Of course, I have already purchased most, if not all of the Taylor’s I am likely to buy and they are likely after a younger buyer.
That said, while I doubt I want one of the new 500’s it will be fun to try one when I see one….
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I'll add my disappointed sentiments too.
I always looked forward to sitting down with a cup of coffee (or glass of wine) and reading the print edition of W&S.
Another sad sign of the times
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An indirect casualty?
I enjoyed the discussion here, after we all received and read our print copies of W&S. Yes, it's still available digitally, but with the sentiments here, I wonder if our discussions will suffer. Just thinking out loud. ???
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....Of course, I have already purchased most, if not all of the Taylor’s I am likely to buy and they are likely after a younger buyer....
These posts may have hit the nail on the head. Us older folks already have our Taylor guitars and have churned through the "flavors of the month" to settle on the keepers. So they are using the new media to go after younger customers. Us old fogies who like paper and print may not be all that important to ongoing sales any longer. We've aged out of the new business model.
....but with the sentiments here, I wonder if our discussions will suffer. Just thinking out loud. ???
As for Susie's second point, it seems like things are pretty quiet around here lately. The changes as implemented by Taylor Guitars over the last couple of years seem to be alienating many of us, intentionally or not, and that seems to be reflected in reduced forum participation recently. My dos centavos....
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....but with the sentiments here, I wonder if our discussions will suffer. Just thinking out loud. ???
As for Susie's second point, it seems like things are pretty quiet around here lately. The changes as implemented by Taylor Guitars over the last couple of years seem to be alienating many of us, intentionally or not, and that seems to be reflected in reduced forum participation recently. My dos centavos....
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I found it interesting that there are no threads on the “urban ironbark” 500’s that were announced a couple weeks ago. I really like the discussions here but it has been quiet lately. They are selling more guitars than ever so hopefully some of the younger crowd will join us soon.
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I think that if the recent offerings from Taylor were offending people, this would be the first place they'd be airing their grievances. This forum has always had peaks and valleys in terms of user numbers. I don't know -- maybe people are just bored.
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The "old fogies" comments is on target for me, LOL! It has been a looong time now since I've succumbed to the "flavor of the month," and it is absolutely true that I've got the guits and gear that speak to me as keepers. So goes the old media of glossy print and a cup o joe/slosh o bourbon; well, perhaps, those really are the bygone days. But that is me, and perhaps the mother ship has made a calculated decision that benefits their future. Such is the cycle.
It really has been rather quiet here around, Earl! You voiced it, but I was thinking the same some weeks ago. I do enjoy the discussions, banter, and of course pics of acquisitions. Perhaps, then, this is the moment where I re-direct my focus: from the Taylor ware of present toward the playing, gigging, overall joy and miscellaneous ramblings of the old-fogie owner! No sense in my lamenting the loss of x when I can revel in the y and z. And yes, I am just wondering aloud here and am still under the waking stupor of coffee that is still brewing.
Great comments here, all! I truly dig this community as your presence and contributions here add so much to the joy of the music. So with that, I say read on, post on, and rock on! Oh, and a good Sunday to you all! :)
Edward
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As a newcomer to Taylor, I am also very disappointed. This was a big selling point for me. A REAL quality printed magazine. The digital copy just isn't going to work for me. I have four Taylors now. If this is purely a cost thing, I can bet a subscriber system would work and be very popular. I would subscribe.
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It really has been rather quiet here around, Earl! You voiced it, but I was thinking the same some weeks ago. I do enjoy the discussions, banter, and of course pics of acquisitions. Perhaps, then, this is the moment where I re-direct my focus: from the Taylor ware of present toward the playing, gigging, overall joy and miscellaneous ramblings of the old-fogie owner!
That is a healthy attitude, Edward, and one that I share. My efforts have shifted from forum participation (both here and elsewhere) into more playing. Just last Tuesday I acquired a duplicate Rainsong WS-1000 from an elderly friend who cannot play any longer. It was a favor to him and I now have two identical guitars that are basically my favorites. I've spent a lot of time with the newer one on my screened-in back porch on these lovely falls days, while the original sits in the living room ready for its turn. Shade at 75° is a great way to spend 60-90 minutes playing through part of my repertoire. And the cat likes it too.....
I find myself in the unusual position of not really needing to acquire any new instruments, and there is little reason to visit a music store these days.
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Yeah, I hear you on the music stores thing ...I've long stopped visiting them unless I have a specific goal or curiosity.
The one exception to this is when travelling: I love to see what shops around the country have in store, particularly the used gear. One interesting shop I stumbled into was in Mexico City with no shortage of really good stuff all over the showroom. No "deals" to be had, but nice seeing some good ware that I could spend a bit of time with.
BTW, really good point by skyman about a subscriber option! I wonder if the mothership would entertain such a possibility as I'd pony up for hardcopy if it were available. (pssst, hey skyman, you a 911 carguy?)
Edward
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Yeah, I hear you on the music stores thing ...I've long stopped visiting them unless I have a specific goal or curiosity.
The one exception to this is when travelling: I love to see what shops around the country have in store, particularly the used gear. One interesting shop I stumbled into was in Mexico City with no shortage of really good stuff all over the showroom. No "deals" to be had, but nice seeing some good ware that I could spend a bit of time with.
BTW, really good point by skyman about a subscriber option! I wonder if the mothership would entertain such a possibility as I'd pony up for hardcopy if it were available. (pssst, hey skyman, you a 911 carguy?)
Edward
Yeah, 2004 911 Turbo X50. Fun little car.
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Off Topic:
Ahhh 996 with x50 ...uber nice! Aircooled guy here. Enjoy the beastie!
Just for clarity, all, there is both wood and steel in various 911s, lest some think I took this thread off the deep end. Just sayin! :D
Edward
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Since we're off the deep end,
The air cooled cars are the best without a doubt. I also have a 67.5 Datsun 200 Roadster. Probably more fun to drive than the 911.
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It had to happen sooner or later, and that time has come. Just received my last printed copy of Wood & Steel. They announce in the issue they're discontinuing it due to costs and sustainability and to focus on a richer multi-media experience in the digital version they introduced during the pandemic. They say they will continue to refine and innovate the digital version and you can subscribe to it to be notified when it comes out. A sad milestone.
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Sad, indeed
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I may be the only person here who isn't unhappy about this. Hey, I really get how some people like to have a hard copy in their hands. I just don't happen to be one of those people.
I do 99 percent of all my reading online. My vision is not the greatest, and so I am very appreciative of the ability to enlarge fonts to a comfortable level for me.
I haven't bought a newspaper in years, and I read all my books on Kindle or Apple Books. This works great for me, especially when I travel. So reading Wood and Steel online is just a natural thing for me.
So while my use case may be different than most, I'm perfectly happy with having just the online version which I enjoy reading on my iPad. YMMV, and I do get that. :)
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Hey Beachbum, I agree. I do more reading on screens these days, as my aging eyes require it. (I don't like to use reading glasses if at all possible). As long as they still produce a PDF version that I can download, I'm OK going purely digital. I don't bother trying to read the web-based version any more.
The web version is annoying. I get uncommanded scrolling and pages jump up and down on the screen - a very frustrating reading experience. That happens on both my Windows desktop and my iPad. It is possible for programmers and web site builders to get way too clever with the effects.... just because they CAN. I recall in the days of the first Macintosh computers in the mid 80's how memos at work suddenly came out with eight or nine fonts on the same page, just because it was easy. It's hard to resist playing with a new toy (or new function), but that settled down after a while.
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I may be the only person here who isn't unhappy about this. Hey, I really get how some people like to have a hard copy in their hands. I just don't happen to be one of those people.
I do 99 percent of all my reading online. My vision is not the greatest, and so I am very appreciative of the ability to enlarge fonts to a comfortable level for me.
I haven't bought a newspaper in years, and I read all my books on Kindle or Apple Books. This works great for me, especially when I travel. So reading Wood and Steel online is just a natural thing for me.
So while my use case may be different than most, I'm perfectly happy with having just the online version which I enjoy reading on my iPad. YMMV, and I do get that. :)
And that's great...for those who like to do that. Now, if they just produced a print version that was ALSO online.....oh wait, they HAD that and eliminated the print completely. Thus all the commentary here.
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I may be the only person here who isn't unhappy about this. Hey, I really get how some people like to have a hard copy in their hands. I just don't happen to be one of those people.
I do 99 percent of all my reading online. My vision is not the greatest, and so I am very appreciative of the ability to enlarge fonts to a comfortable level for me.
I haven't bought a newspaper in years, and I read all my books on Kindle or Apple Books. This works great for me, especially when I travel. So reading Wood and Steel online is just a natural thing for me.
So while my use case may be different than most, I'm perfectly happy with having just the online version which I enjoy reading on my iPad. YMMV, and I do get that. :)
And that's great...for those who like to do that. Now, if they just produced a print version that was ALSO online.....oh wait, they HAD that and eliminated the print completely. Thus all the commentary here.
Fair point. If most people don't like it, I get it. That's just what I meant by YMMV.
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Not sure why you're posting it twice but yes, definitely a YMMV situation. I guess Taylor is OK with leaving folks like me (and many others on this forum) to just forget about W&S in favor of those who prefer the screen. "Modern world" and all that nonsense said in the name of making more (and/or spending less) money. There's only a few big guitar companies who have the brand loyalty that Taylor does. Sad to see the "new owners" flush that down the toilet by digitalizing (and ONLY digitalizing) W&S.
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Sorry for the double post. I have no idea how that happened.
And yes, I agree that "progress" certainly can be just the opposite for some people.
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I have been tuning my 12 strings down for nearly 60 years.
I have been drinking the same brand of tea for over 65 years.
I have a kindle, but I don't use it much. I like to read real books and I willingly pay for the privilege of doing so. I would never ever think of using a kindle for serious research.
I still have a library card and use it to get hard-to-find books.
I was the victim of a classical education and I am immensely grateful for it.
I never let school interfere with my education.
I taught myself to play guitar in large part through books.
I taught myself to program a computer through books.
I had to get a later-in-life graduate degree in computer programming to work in the field, but I am a Luddite at heart. No cell phone.
I guess what I'm saying is that old habits die hard. Especially the enjoyable ones.
And I would pay for a printed subscription to "Wood & Steel". And I do appreciate all the "free" issues I received. Gee, all I had to do was buy a new Taylor guitar. Or two . . .
Hey Taylor management, would that help grease the wheels?
Don
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...And I would pay for a printed subscription to "Wood & Steel". And I do appreciate all the "free" issues I received. Gee, all I had to do was buy a new Taylor guitar. Or two . . .
Don
Nice list, Don! :D
While no luddite myself, I am still very "analog" in many of my choices. And I think for some things, print really is the best medium. Sign me up for a paid subscription to W&S ...that's an easy decision to make, and I'd order in a heartbeat (and I'd pay digitally ;) ).
Edward
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I too would be more than happy to pay to keep receiving a print version. The digital version of most everything looses it on me.
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...And I would pay for a printed subscription to "Wood & Steel". And I do appreciate all the "free" issues I received. Gee, all I had to do was buy a new Taylor guitar. Or two . . .
Don
Nice list, Don! :D
While no luddite myself, I am still very "analog" in many of my choices. And I think for some things, print really is the best medium. Sign me up for a paid subscription to W&S ...that's an easy decision to make, and I'd order in a heartbeat (and I'd pay digitally ;) ).
Edward
Agreed, I would be almost happy to receive the W&S in subscription form. On the upside, GAS will subside without the W&S by my night stand.
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...And I would pay for a printed subscription to "Wood & Steel". And I do appreciate all the "free" issues I received. Gee, all I had to do was buy a new Taylor guitar. Or two . . .
Don
Nice list, Don! :D
While no luddite myself, I am still very "analog" in many of my choices. And I think for some things, print really is the best medium. Sign me up for a paid subscription to W&S ...that's an easy decision to make, and I'd order in a heartbeat (and I'd pay digitally ;) ).
Edward
Agreed, I would be almost happy to receive the W&S in subscription form. On the upside, GAS will subside without the W&S by my night stand.
Exactly! This is penny wise and pound foolish for Taylor AFAIC. All they had to do was sell, what...3 to 5 (maybe 10) guitars and they'd clear enough to keep W&S in print each year. The fact that it's no longer in print (and in the hands of potential buyers) potentially means LESS guitars sold and that's a bottom line LOSS to Taylor. A foolish, short sighted move.
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...And I would pay for a printed subscription to "Wood & Steel". And I do appreciate all the "free" issues I received. Gee, all I had to do was buy a new Taylor guitar. Or two . . .
Don
Nice list, Don! :D
While no luddite myself, I am still very "analog" in many of my choices. And I think for some things, print really is the best medium. Sign me up for a paid subscription to W&S ...that's an easy decision to make, and I'd order in a heartbeat (and I'd pay digitally ;) ).
Edward
Agreed, I would be almost happy to receive the W&S in subscription form. On the upside, GAS will subside without the W&S by my night stand.
Exactly! This is penny wise and pound foolish for Taylor AFAIC. All they had to do was sell, what...3 to 5 (maybe 10) guitars and they'd clear enough to keep W&S in print each year. The fact that it's no longer in print (and in the hands of potential buyers) potentially means LESS guitars sold and that's a bottom line LOSS to Taylor. A foolish, short sighted move.
I initially thought it 'wood' be cost saving by not needing workers to do the magazine, but then I realized they would still be needed to do the digital issues too. In fact they probably have been doing print versions on software editors for quite some time. But I would still like a print version delivered. And the photos are so 'inspiring'.
Unfortunately there are a great many people who use their electronic devices as sole sources of most everything, which can devolve into a lot of 'film at 11' type of articles with all the associated lack of details.
So I will still 'swipe left' on this idea.
Don
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I too "swipe left" on the idea of a paid subscription. I like the idea of paper copies showing all those wonderful photos, and I have most of them stored away. If you look at my list of guitars in my signature, several of them were LTD's and I would only have become aware of them through W&S. But for several years now more than 50% of the content is self-congratulatory praise and what can only be described as corporate green washing. When the magazine comes to me free (either paper or digital) I can skip that content -- no harm, no foul. But paying for it would become quite annoying.
I feel the same way about other magazines too. I started subscribing to Acoustic Guitar magazine at issue #2 back in 1990. But a few years ago, I counted up the content in the latest issue. There were 40 pages with some editorial "content" and 45 pages of advertising. At one time when they started, the articles were quite in-depth and contained considerable information. Later the content seemed considerably dumbed down, and a feature article from the cover was maybe 3-6 column-inches. That is when I quit subscribing. I guess this old guy aged out of the target demographic and current shorter attention spans. Now get off my lawn! [shaking cane] Back to my cave now.......
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I too "swipe left" on the idea of a paid subscription. I like the idea of paper copies showing all those wonderful photos, and I have most of them stored away. If you look at my list of guitars in my signature, several of them were LTD's and I would only have become aware of them through W&S. But for several years now more than 50% of the content is self-congratulatory praise and what can only be described as corporate green washing. When the magazine comes to me free (either paper or digital) I can skip that content -- no harm, no foul. But paying for it would become quite annoying.
I feel the same way about other magazines too. I started subscribing to Acoustic Guitar magazine at issue #2 back in 1990. But a few years ago, I counted up the content in the latest issue. There were 40 pages with some editorial "content" and 45 pages of advertising. At one time when they started, the articles were quite in-depth and contained considerable information. Later the content seemed considerably dumbed down, and a feature article from the cover was maybe 3-6 column-inches. That is when I quit subscribing. I guess this old guy aged out of the target demographic and current shorter attention spans. Now get off my lawn! [shaking cane] Back to my cave now.......
Earl, Acoustic Guitar changed management about four years ago, and since then the articles seem to have gotten more robust.
I used to be a writer for them, so terms like "dumbing down" don't particularly appeal to me.
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My favorite part of W&S was the "Ask Bob" section. For reason that seemed to be the part I gravitated towards. The questions were always pretty interesting as were the answers.
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I too "swipe left" on the idea of a paid subscription. I like the idea of paper copies showing all those wonderful photos, and I have most of them stored away. If you look at my list of guitars in my signature, several of them were LTD's and I would only have become aware of them through W&S. But for several years now more than 50% of the content is self-congratulatory praise and what can only be described as corporate green washing. When the magazine comes to me free (either paper or digital) I can skip that content -- no harm, no foul. But paying for it would become quite annoying.
I feel the same way about other magazines too. I started subscribing to Acoustic Guitar magazine at issue #2 back in 1990. But a few years ago, I counted up the content in the latest issue. There were 40 pages with some editorial "content" and 45 pages of advertising. At one time when they started, the articles were quite in-depth and contained considerable information. Later the content seemed considerably dumbed down, and a feature article from the cover was maybe 3-6 column-inches. That is when I quit subscribing. I guess this old guy aged out of the target demographic and current shorter attention spans. Now get off my lawn! [shaking cane] Back to my cave now.......
Earl, Acoustic Guitar changed management about four years ago, and since then the articles seem to have gotten more robust.
I used to be a writer for them, so terms like "dumbing down" don't particularly appeal to me.
I think that was around the time I de-subscribed to Acoustic Guitar as well. The quadrupling of the price and fewer issues released in a year was the breaker for me.
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Earl, Acoustic Guitar changed management about four years ago, and since then the articles seem to have gotten more robust. I used to be a writer for them, so terms like "dumbing down" don't particularly appeal to me.
Dennis, no offense intended, and my apologies. I always liked your articles. Since dropping AG magazine about six years ago I have not seen a single issue, so have no idea if / whether they have improved as you say. They are just off my radar. My comment was targeted at the "140 character tweet" nature of the last few things that I recall reading. Not many column-inches, and not much actual content in those few inches, even for things referenced with blurbs on the cover as major feature articles.
I get that magazine publishing is a really tough -- and possibly dying -- business. I've written for several magazines myself, including professional trade journals and some hobbyist titles (aviation, radio control aircraft, kayaking, shooting). I took Fretboard Journal for a while, and it IS great - everything that an enthusiast's magazine should be. But I've drifted away from printed media as my eyesight deteriorates with age. I simply don't like reading glasses for extended periods.
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I think that was around the time I de-subscribed to Acoustic Guitar as well. The quadrupling of the price and fewer issues released in a year was the breaker for me.
I can live with fewer issues if it means higher quality content overall. Even the price is negotiable if there is perceived value. Example: Fretboard Journal. There was a time when you could download two month old issues of AG for free as PDF's if you knew the right codes. It was an effort to have subscribers get both hard copy and digital versions. But after a while, even the content obtained for free was not worth the effort and time spent. At least MY time and effort. IMHO, YMMV.
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So long Wood & Steel
Not sure if this was clear or not, and not sure it even matters, but it does matter to me.
When I said I would still "swipe left on this idea", I was indicating a negative, and that negative meant I was still not in favor of a "digital only" subscription.
But will I get one? Probably.
But remember, we already get that in on-line back issues.
And I would still be willing to get a paid sub for paper issues of W&S.
Don
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We got that "swipe left" meant not for you, Don. I will still pass. The free PDF version is worth the price, IMHO. No matter how pretty the photos are, I would not pay for something where only half of the content was interesting / worth reading, which was the point of my earlier post.
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We got that "swipe left" meant not for you, Don. I will still pass. The free PDF version is worth the price, IMHO. No matter how pretty the photos are, I would not pay for something where only half of the content was interesting / worth reading, which was the point of my earlier post.
Gotcha.
Be well and play well,
Don
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Here is a small win.
I thought Taylor might put out a yearly model guide in print.
Today I went into my local guitar shop, they have a Taylor room, and in the rack that used to hold Wood and Steel was “Wood and Steel 2023 Taylor Product Guide”!
It won’t be the same as a quarterly W&S but it’s something. I assume they will be mailing it to registered owners.
Ps if anyone wants a subscription printed guitar magazine I suggest “Fretboard Journal” it’s not cheap but it is a great publication, a good choice to fill the printed guitar information void.
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I figured that they would still do an annual "catalog" like they used to years ago. In the 90's there was a slick annual product guide and the quarterly newsprint W&S. Then they went to the glossy W&S with the winter issue becoming the annual guitar guide. That issue had more depth about the various series, tone woods, and other info. I may have to swing by my LGS to grab a print copy, just for the archive. But I will look to see if there is a posted PDF first, to save the auto gas.
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They do plan to produce a hard copy of the product guide.
Quoting from the last W&S sent to me:
"We do plan to print an annual product guide edition in late January and distribute it to authorized Taylor dealers, so you'll be able to pick up a tangible copy if you like."
Well, at least there is that going for us. Except I don't live near and AD, the closest one is Guitar Center, do you think they will have them available and laying around to collect?
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I looked on the web site and could not find a PDF version of the 2023 guitar guide (yet). Looks like I'll have to drive across town at some point to my local store and pick up a hard copy. Or not.........
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They do plan to produce a hard copy of the product guide.
Quoting from the last W&S sent to me:
"We do plan to print an annual product guide edition in late January and distribute it to authorized Taylor dealers, so you'll be able to pick up a tangible copy if you like."
Well, at least there is that going for us. Except I don't live near and AD, the closest one is Guitar Center, do you think they will have them available and laying around to collect?
Yep, 2 posts above yours :
"Today I went into my local guitar shop, they have a Taylor room, and in the rack that used to hold Wood and Steel was “Wood and Steel 2023 Taylor Product Guide”!"
The W&S regular edition used to regularly be in a rack by the door at my local GC so yes, IF they have them then they'll be "available and lying around".
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They do plan to produce a hard copy of the product guide.
Quoting from the last W&S sent to me:
"We do plan to print an annual product guide edition in late January and distribute it to authorized Taylor dealers, so you'll be able to pick up a tangible copy if you like."
Well, at least there is that going for us. Except I don't live near and AD, the closest one is Guitar Center, do you think they will have them available and laying around to collect?
Yep, 2 posts above yours :
"Today I went into my local guitar shop, they have a Taylor room, and in the rack that used to hold Wood and Steel was “Wood and Steel 2023 Taylor Product Guide”!"
The W&S regular edition used to regularly be in a rack by the door at my local GC so yes, IF they have them then they'll be "available and lying around".
I hope my closest GC will have them, but I won't hold my breath. This GC has only a small number of quality guitars on hand. They don't have a Taylor room. Rarely have I seen more than 5 Taylors and same for Martins hanging on the walls. I don't believe I have ever seen a W&S there. I am not hopeful for this particular GC to have a stack of Taylor product guides for the taking, But things do change, lets wait and see.
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No, W&S still exists, it's just moved to a wholly digital version. As someone who actually contributes to W&S, it's a much better delivery. I make video content, as well as occasionally writing, and this format allows videos to be embedded right into articles, which is great. It not only allows you to read about an artist, but also to see and hear them within the body of the article, or to see Bob Taylor answering questions by showing you what the answer is in Ask Bob videos. It's hugely useful.
Also, print is insanely expensive. I don't work at Taylor, but it's gotta be most of their marketing budget just going to print W&S issues as my estimates have each issue over $100K in printing alone, much less mailing them out. Also, so many don't get to people, get destroyed in the mail, or get returned to sender. And nearly all of it eventually ends up in the trash bin. I'm glad they're using the budget for other things. I've been traveling more to shoot for Taylor this year so far than any previous year, including artist content, the current piece about the Bluebird Cafe, and all kinds of stuff. I'm about to go film with Bob Taylor at Pacific Rim Tonewoods, which I've wanted to do for 5 years. Print is expensive and frankly really wasteful. Paper, ink, shipping - it's all so costly. Digital is a better format. It's how I read books now too because I can take my iPad on planes instead of trying to carry 3 books.
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No, W&S still exists, it's just moved to a wholly digital version. As someone who actually contributes to W&S, it's a much better delivery. I make video content, as well as occasionally writing, and this format allows videos to be embedded right into articles, which is great. It not only allows you to read about an artist, but also to see and hear them within the body of the article, or to see Bob Taylor answering questions by showing you what the answer is in Ask Bob videos. It's hugely useful.
Also, print is insanely expensive. I don't work at Taylor, but it's gotta be most of their marketing budget just going to print W&S issues as my estimates have each issue over $100K in printing alone, much less mailing them out. Also, so many don't get to people, get destroyed in the mail, or get returned to sender. And nearly all of it eventually ends up in the trash bin. I'm glad they're using the budget for other things. I've been traveling more to shoot for Taylor this year so far than any previous year, including artist content, the current piece about the Bluebird Cafe, and all kinds of stuff. I'm about to go film with Bob Taylor at Pacific Rim Tonewoods, which I've wanted to do for 5 years. Print is expensive and frankly really wasteful. Paper, ink, shipping - it's all so costly. Digital is a better format. It's how I read books now too because I can take my iPad on planes instead of trying to carry 3 books.
HUGE respect for you Gabriel and for all you do but you're wrong about it being a "better format". Easier for Taylor to produce and distribute? Yes. Less costly? Yes. A "better format"? Multiple studies show no, that we don't take in or retain the information the same way from a screen as we do in print. Due to that I will no longer read W&S. It's actually easier for me too...I just delete the email instead of reading the print magazine and having to walk all the way to my recycling bin. I wish Taylor luck with the future but sad to see them abandon the W&S in print as I'll never see it again (and many of my Taylor owning friends seem to feel the same way).
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I mean, that's fine no one is gonna make you read it. But as you said, yours was ending up in the bin. That's where most of them end up, as waste. People create a lot of waste and I'm all for cutting down on it as much as we can. Print magazines in general are going away. The inks have heavy metals in them and some of the glossy coatings are plastic, which makes paper non-recyclable. And again, spending that money to print and mail something 3x per year is extremely expensive. I'd have cut it years ago, the same way I cut billboard advertising when I was marketing director for a manufacturing company (saving them over $50K/year) in favor of digital ads.
We're here typing in a digital forum because we've long since moved into a digital world where 80% of Internet traffic is video alone. As a company they're more likely to have success investing in that. Print newspaper and magazine circulation have cratered and the same people who say they'd pay for W&S aren't paying for those things, they're not paying for paywalled news content either. It's a more efficient format, has a much wider potential reach, and while you may not read it most will. The stats already show that or they wouldn't have stopped print. And the benefits go down the line - constant calls and emails because someone who moved and never updated their address didn't get their copy, copies getting destroyed in the mail, copies getting returned because they were undeliverable - the loss is too much to bear and while some people say they'd be willing to pay for it, most aren't and those who are aren't gonna pay enough to make up the difference. So digital is yes better. It's more a much wider audience and is cheaper to make, which frees up money to make more for it.
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Kudos to Gabriel: thanks for your insight from "within." It is essential that other data points --and perspectives, to be sure-- be shared as it tempers animus, or at the very least, quells simmering resentment that is genuinely easy to brew in the echo chamber of net blogs. Moreover, thanks for doing what you do because, after all, we love Taylor guitars!
The "better format" that is a digital medium is entirely better for the company: time, materials, and dollars spent where they find that they can save this capital and, may I assume, spend it on other company endeavors. That this is "better" for the company is not hard to understand. But "better format" is a claim that describes the company's stance, not the end user, let alone the potential consumer of these pricey goods. Better for "a" but worse for "b" is my point.
Let us not confuse this contention. There is no shortage of people who are not luddites; no scarcity of those neck deep in today's technology because it defines today's living, yet find innumerable advantages in what many call "analog" choices. This often is not for their lack of understanding but for their conscious and reasoned choices. I choose an analog watch, for example, knowing full well what a "smart watch" brings to the table. Yet the one with hands is on my wrist. It is the better choice because it suits my purpose.
So it is purpose, then, that drives Taylor's decision. I get this; we understand the economic benefit of the move, I'm sure. Likewise, it is a company's purpose to serve its customer base while trying to create the next one. This is where a company can hit or miss. I have long applauded Taylor's boldness and foresight to move the needle in a positive direction. Taylor's growth suits players, but even more, benefits the industry as we have witnessed. But not every move is golden. Not for any company. Whatever direction they deem "better" has to be mutually agreed upon by the marketplace. This symbiosis builds a company; failing to understand this delicate balance is what brings industrial giants to their demise.
W&S changing platforms is but one change, and alone will likely not deter a purchase. But moves taken in sum, in a direction that alienates the very market that has built them, can be perilous. All companies know this, but not all companies heed. Time will tell.
Edward
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You know, I really appreciate Bob and Kurt's columns but the rest of their magazine does not resonate with me. I'll read the bits I want on line.
My Bride has been involved with the printing and distribution of a local (color) magazine so I know how much everything costs from printing to postage. It's outrageous. To me, nothing compares with having a book or magazine in your hand but I can't fault them at all for deciding to go digital.
What I wonder is if some bright independent printing house will rise to the occasion for all the folks who absolutely must have a print copy of their favorite publication. You could $ub$cribe to them to have your favorite "Digital" periodical downloaded, printed and mailed to your home. Just a thought, I'm off to practice now....
Scott
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The first purpose of a company is to stay in business. You can’t serve your customers if you’re no longer there, and the generation of people deeply attached to print is, frankly, waning. Business needs change. When Taylor became a client of mine 6 years ago, they were years behind the industry on video content. They made almost none. I was one of two people working with them. Now they have an inside production team and work with 7 or 8 outside suppliers too. I’m about to travel to film content with Bob Taylor and others for a project. Telling these stories with words, photos, and videos is to me more valuable than seeing them on a piece of paper.
Kudos to Gabriel: thanks for your insight from "within." It is essential that other data points --and perspectives, to be sure-- be shared as it tempers animus, or at the very least, quells simmering resentment that is genuinely easy to brew in the echo chamber of net blogs. Moreover, thanks for doing what you do because, after all, we love Taylor guitars!
The "better format" that is a digital medium is entirely better for the company: time, materials, and dollars spent where they find that they can save this capital and, may I assume, spend it on other company endeavors. That this is "better" for the company is not hard to understand. But "better format" is a claim that describes the company's stance, not the end user, let alone the potential consumer of these pricey goods. Better for "a" but worse for "b" is my point.
Let us not confuse this contention. There is no shortage of people who are not luddites; no scarcity of those neck deep in today's technology because it defines today's living, yet find innumerable advantages in what many call "analog" choices. This often is not for their lack of understanding but for their conscious and reasoned choices. I choose an analog watch, for example, knowing full well what a "smart watch" brings to the table. Yet the one with hands is on my wrist. It is the better choice because it suits my purpose.
So it is purpose, then, that drives Taylor's decision. I get this; we understand the economic benefit of the move, I'm sure. Likewise, it is a company's purpose to serve its customer base while trying to create the next one. This is where a company can hit or miss. I have long applauded Taylor's boldness and foresight to move the needle in a positive direction. Taylor's growth suits players, but even more, benefits the industry as we have witnessed. But not every move is golden. Not for any company. Whatever direction they deem "better" has to be mutually agreed upon by the marketplace. This symbiosis builds a company; failing to understand this delicate balance is what brings industrial giants to their demise.
W&S changing platforms is but one change, and alone will likely not deter a purchase. But moves taken in sum, in a direction that alienates the very market that has built them, can be perilous. All companies know this, but not all companies heed. Time will tell.
Edward
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Personally, I much prefer to ingest things that interest me in print and avoid most videos.
How many times have you started reading an article only to find the author has buried the bit you're interested in way down the near the bottom. With print it's easy to "fast forward" paragraph by paragraph until you get to the part you're there for. Try that with a similarly structured video.
In general, it seems, at least to me, a lot of entities produce a video so they can insert ads into their content in order to monetize their audience. Oh well, in another 25 years or so my opinion won't count near as much...
Scott
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...In general, it seems, at least to me, a lot of entities produce a video so they can insert ads into their content in order to monetize their audience. Oh well, in another 25 years or so my opinion won't count near as much...
Scott
That bold part is me right now, lol! So I will continue to opine, knowing all the well I have long fallen outside Taylor's demographic for future sales. So I have nothing to lose (well, not completely true as Taylor still is unrivaled in customer service for owners, so this is still important, but as for selling me a new guit, nah!). I am not ignorant of the fact that business must churn profit if it desires to continue serving its base, and cost cutting is survival; this is basic grade-level economics that really warrants no clarification. Simple point: all businesses make these economic choices with every "thing" they do. The very point of a "loss leader," for example, is to take a hit here so you can gain there. Ahhh, a reasoned choice to lose small in order to gain big. It's a risk; all business is a risk. The most intuitive are the ones that thrive. My hope is Taylor keeps the main thing the main thing.
Edward
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I'm a print guy from long ago. Especially car mags which are falling by the wayside.
But what I will miss the most is the smell of ink on the printed page!!!
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Just reading all this give and take about print versus digital doesn't address the issue. It only displays Taylor's unilateral decision making process.
To me the issue is what does the customer prefer. Earlier in the thread, I offered to purchase a paid subscription if that were available.
To date, I have seen ZERO survey requests on how I feel about this and would I then pay to help subsidize a print version. The answer is still yes. I have a sub to 'Fretboard Journal' and that isn't cheap, and it's quarterly. And I will admit to using the W&S digital version to access some stuff from early issues.
I also read multiple books a month let alone a year. About half are fiction (more if you count historical fiction as a learning tool), and the useful non-fiction books become personal library reference material. And It's not subject to electrical blackouts, no-service, or battery drains. I do have a kindle, and the only good feature is to choose the size of the type. How do I go back to the last chapter to re-read something I missed or mis-interpreted?
I learned to play from guitar books, starting with the Mel Bay chord book.
And when I go looking at guitars, I bring an old analog caliper (inherited from my grandfather) to check string gauges. Newer digital ones fail miserably and are larger and way awkward to schlep around, let alone use. Guess how I know?
So to bemoan a lost cause, as far as I know Taylor did not canvas it's current 'subscribers' to see what opinions are out there and would a subscription be economically viable. Especially since the only way you could get a sub to W&S was to purchase and register a new Taylor guitar. And W&S was advertising new products to it's current customers just by featuring new models in the magazine. How may sales did that influence?
I personally own a half-dozen Taylors. The only one I didn't find out about in W&S was the first one I bought new in '99. And I had a friend who owned a couple of Taylors at the time so I knew what I was getting into, and how good they were. I realize the pandemic made a lot of things difficult and different, but to like the song goes, my Taylor 'brand loyalty' is slip-slidin' away.
And my personal best argument for a print version:
I totally refuse to bring an electronic device into the bathroom for sitting on the 'Throne of China'.
(Old habits die hard.)
Be well and play well,
Don
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Well, Don,
Your thoughts are not lost on this thread. But Gabriel did address in part the point of a subscription-based mag. It's still expensive, and they'd still have to pop for all the costs of production for a product/service that they are unsure will be covered by its subscribers.
Like I said in my previous post, I get what they're thinking completely. Unilateral decision because, heck, it's their ball game. That said, we pay to attend. So to your point, that economic choice they made may (will?) have repercussions to its existing base who still want product x. A printed magazine, in itself, certainly is no deal killer. But changes made that do not please the base, over time, in sum, absolutely affect a company's reputation and street cred which, bottom line, affects their bottom line. Time will tell as I'm just a guy with a regular day job who likes music. :D
Edward
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changes made that do not please the base, over time, in sum, absolutely affect a company's reputation and street cred which, bottom line, affects their bottom line.
Quoted for factualness. We buy an expensive instrument and then they say the little magazine is costing them too much? I think it's this type of mindset (along with increased competition) that is and will continue to cost Taylor their customer base.
Just to point out that e-magazines aren't exactly green either (responding to the "bin" comment made about one of my earlier posts). It takes a lot of fossil fuel generated energy to create, store and distribute an online magazine and that's just a fact. At least my old W&S's went on to become something else made from paper. The e-version just continues to eat electricity whether I read it or not and long after anyone stops reading it altogether.
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Just reading all this give and take about print versus digital doesn't address the issue. It only displays Taylor's unilateral decision making process.
To me the issue is what does the customer prefer. Earlier in the thread, I offered to purchase a paid subscription if that were available.
To date, I have seen ZERO survey requests on how I feel about this and would I then pay to help subsidize a print version. The answer is still yes. I have a sub to 'Fretboard Journal' and that isn't cheap, and it's quarterly. And I will admit to using the W&S digital version to access some stuff from early issues.
I also read multiple books a month let alone a year. About half are fiction (more if you count historical fiction as a learning tool), and the useful non-fiction books become personal library reference material. And It's not subject to electrical blackouts, no-service, or battery drains. I do have a kindle, and the only good feature is to choose the size of the type. How do I go back to the last chapter to re-read something I missed or mis-interpreted?
I learned to play from guitar books, starting with the Mel Bay chord book.
And when I go looking at guitars, I bring an old analog caliper (inherited from my grandfather) to check string gauges. Newer digital ones fail miserably and are larger and way awkward to schlep around, let alone use. Guess how I know?
So to bemoan a lost cause, as far as I know Taylor did not canvas it's current 'subscribers' to see what opinions are out there and would a subscription be economically viable. Especially since the only way you could get a sub to W&S was to purchase and register a new Taylor guitar. And W&S was advertising new products to it's current customers just by featuring new models in the magazine. How may sales did that influence?
I personally own a half-dozen Taylors. The only one I didn't find out about in W&S was the first one I bought new in '99. And I had a friend who owned a couple of Taylors at the time so I knew what I was getting into, and how good they were. I realize the pandemic made a lot of things difficult and different, but to like the song goes, my Taylor 'brand loyalty' is slip-slidin' away.
And my personal best argument for a print version:
I totally refuse to bring an electronic device into the bathroom for sitting on the 'Throne of China'.
(Old habits die hard.)
Be well and play well,
Don
I do some of my best reading/thinking on the commode, but I'm a old man with old ways.
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As I said before, I would be perfectly happy with a PDF download for each quarterly issue, as they have long done. I find their web formatting to be odd and unstable, whereas a PDF is always easy to handle - it doesn't do anything like scroll, link, or zoom unless I ask it to. The business decision to stop publishing the expensive paper magazine for us dinosaurs is understandable. As a business owner I probably would do the same. But please don't force me to suffer through that truly God-awful web format that executes un-commanded jumps and scrolls, making the normal content nearly impossible to read and an exercise in frustration. It is bad on my Windows desktop with Chrome as a browser, and even worse on my current iPad with the latest IOS. I almost never watch the videos anyway, but spend half of my time on the web page scrolling up and down just to finish sentences. Arrggghhh! :o :(
if you look at my profile and ownership history, many of them were LTD's or brand new models. Guess where you learn about limited editions? I have asked dealers to order those on my behalf, and might never have known but for Wood & Steel.
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Just reading all this give and take about print versus digital doesn't address the issue. It only displays Taylor's unilateral decision making process.
To me the issue is what does the customer prefer. Earlier in the thread, I offered to purchase a paid subscription if that were available.
To date, I have seen ZERO survey requests on how I feel about this and would I then pay to help subsidize a print version. The answer is still yes. I have a sub to 'Fretboard Journal' and that isn't cheap, and it's quarterly. And I will admit to using the W&S digital version to access some stuff from early issues.
I also read multiple books a month let alone a year. About half are fiction (more if you count historical fiction as a learning tool), and the useful non-fiction books become personal library reference material. And It's not subject to electrical blackouts, no-service, or battery drains. I do have a kindle, and the only good feature is to choose the size of the type. How do I go back to the last chapter to re-read something I missed or mis-interpreted?
I learned to play from guitar books, starting with the Mel Bay chord book.
And when I go looking at guitars, I bring an old analog caliper (inherited from my grandfather) to check string gauges. Newer digital ones fail miserably and are larger and way awkward to schlep around, let alone use. Guess how I know?
So to bemoan a lost cause, as far as I know Taylor did not canvas it's current 'subscribers' to see what opinions are out there and would a subscription be economically viable. Especially since the only way you could get a sub to W&S was to purchase and register a new Taylor guitar. And W&S was advertising new products to it's current customers just by featuring new models in the magazine. How may sales did that influence?
I personally own a half-dozen Taylors. The only one I didn't find out about in W&S was the first one I bought new in '99. And I had a friend who owned a couple of Taylors at the time so I knew what I was getting into, and how good they were. I realize the pandemic made a lot of things difficult and different, but to like the song goes, my Taylor 'brand loyalty' is slip-slidin' away.
And my personal best argument for a print version:
I totally refuse to bring an electronic device into the bathroom for sitting on the 'Throne of China'.
(Old habits die hard.)
Be well and play well,
Don
I do some of my best reading/thinking on the commode, but I'm a old man with old ways.
Just for the record, so am I; 3/4 of a century's worth of milestones behind me. And I'm not planning to go anywhere. And it is my opinion that since the magazine was never marketed to the public, and was often given away free at Taylor dealers' locations, it was never designed to cost money. It has been making all it's readers feel like members of the Taylor community and served a dual purpose in alerting these members to new additions to the Taylor line. Which goes back to sales and loss leaders. Besides, they have been well written and informative, and I could easily excuse any Taylor bias. Mostly because I already had a pro-Taylor bias myself, and W&S was some gratis grease to keep me interested and motivated. Most every Taylor player I know or heard about owned more than one Taylor. Not an accident.
Case in point. I personally got a new Taylor 818e directly because of the magazine, not to mention that previously owning a Taylor made it easy to get more of these fine guitars. Which also led me to wanting/getting a 12 string version of the same guitar. (I am a big 12 string fan.) And it's very possible that my playing Taylors may have resulted in others liking and buying a Taylor too. Just think of it as a variant of product placement at a grass-roots level.
And post-pandemic, the last few times I played out, I used either an Epiphone J-200 Jumbo or a Guild F-1512 12 string Jumbo. Mostly because they are my latest instruments and am still learning their idiosyncrasies. And they are both all solid wood guitars with the sound to prove it.
Don
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Well, Don,
Your thoughts are not lost on this thread. But Gabriel did address in part the point of a subscription-based mag. It's still expensive, and they'd still have to pop for all the costs of production for a product/service that they are unsure will be covered by its subscribers.
Like I said in my previous post, I get what they're thinking completely. Unilateral decision because, heck, it's their ball game. That said, we pay to attend. So to your point, that economic choice they made may (will?) have repercussions to its existing base who still want product x. A printed magazine, in itself, certainly is no deal killer. But changes made that do not please the base, over time, in sum, absolutely affect a company's reputation and street cred which, bottom line, affects their bottom line. Time will tell as I'm just a guy with a regular day job who likes music. :D
Edward
Not saying I don't understand the corporate mindset of squeezing every inch of profit and making sure that everything fits into the big picture. Nor do I doubt the time and expense of producing W&S. But think of it this way. It was never meant to be a profit-making enterprise. It really has been, in it's simplest form, a marketing tool and a good will effort to both explain the company and it's goals and to stay in touch with it's growing customer/consumer base. You cannot measure customer satisfaction in dollars and cents. It is mainly measurable by returning customers, which is a subset of those who left with a smile on their face even with the new (and recurring) hole in their wallet.
But Gabriel did address in part the point of a subscription-based mag. It's still expensive, and they'd still have to pop for all the costs of production for a product/service that they are unsure will be covered by its subscribers.
Couple of points. Gabriel has a vested interest (his job) in putting together a digital version no matter what. He has no interest or inclination to continue the printed version. To that end, he will do anything in his power to sink that ship. He is not only creating a new product, he is also founding his own fiefdom with his personal serfs. That's how corporate ladder stuff works.
And the second point about "they are unsure it will be covered by it's subscribers".
Who are 'they' exactly? A non-rhetorical question that has never been satisfactorally answered in the entire human condition. Kind of like a 'silent majority'. Who thinks up this oxymoronic stuff anyway?
No evidence has been offered to support this. Just negative supposition. No canvassing of current "free" subscribers. And it's not free either. You still have to buy a new guitar. And since it is not in Gabriel's best interests, there is no way he would even let a hint of a commitment/conversion to a paying subscriber base upset his little apple-cart. Or more correctly his gravy train.
And Taylor is still going to produce a glossy catalogue, but as far as I could tell, it would only be sent to dealers. Thus putting the lie to the "costs and work" to produce a magazine which is more current than a presumably annual catalogue and more interactive with it's customer base.
Just who is benefiting from all this? Follow the money, which was never there in the first place.
Please note that I am not saying that Taylor doesn't have the right to do whatever it wants from any point of view, including financial. I just think there's a lot of BS on the digital plate being served to "justify" this. And if the money to be spent on the magazine went to saving/buying some rainforest, then I would consider that more in line with Taylor's avowed forestry approach, and would certainly approve as worthwhile.
On a personal note, I really like to read for enjoyment, but not at/on a computer screen. If they want to send me a digital W&S, I will accept it for what it is, another research option. Not necessarily for something that was previously enjoyable to read.
Don
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Well said donlyn, well said.
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Side note 1: No disagreement, Don. I was simply offering "their" points (as in the factory's pov) as I interpret them. Knowing fully well I am speculating. :)
Side note 2: I wonder if the mothership has their ear to the ground on this, or any customer concern. Again, that's open speculation but I can't help but wonder aloud. Heck, it's our forum, right? ...so I'm gonna wonder out loud. ;)
Be well, all ...the times they are a changin, but worry not. At the very least, I trust we have our own fabulous guits we can turn to for solace! :D
Edward
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Side note 1: No disagreement, Don. I was simply offering "their" points (as in the factory's pov) as I interpret them. Knowing fully well I am speculating. :)
Side note 2: I wonder if the mothership has their ear to the ground on this, or any customer concern. Again, that's open speculation but I can't help but wonder aloud. Heck, it's our forum, right? ...so I'm gonna wonder out loud. ;)
Be well, all ...the times they are a changin, but worry not. At the very least, I trust we have our own fabulous guits we can turn to for solace! :D
Edward
Hey Edward,
No beef with you. I got the same impression from Gabriel's comments, but since you summarized them I wanted to not let that pass without commenting. Gabriel has posted here, so somebody is reading this stuff. I don't want to get into any altercations on this, but I've been around the block a few times and my cynicism is showing.
There's an old theory about questions that for every question asked there a a great number of people who didn't want to ask it for whatever reasons, and a greater number of people that didn't even think to ask that question but are now concerned with the answer.
So the number of people currently corresponding here on this issue may be small, and I have no idea of how many other people are reading this at any given moment. But what I do know is that there are a number of people here who have at least a vestige of loyalty to the brand (to me that means enough to care enough to write about it) but don't post very often. Maybe we who are writing here are in a minority, but also maybe not. Based on that question theory at least.
In a minimal, maybe final observation on this topic, I do care what happens, and the receipt of the printed copy I do not take for granted, but appreciate it. It also keeps me connected even though I am not actively looking, but never say never. Unfortunately I seem to be in danger of becoming less connected, at least on an annual basis, and all this doesn't help.
And since the advent of a few issues going digital a while back, digitalization is not surprising, just saddening.
Don
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changes made that do not please the base, over time, in sum, absolutely affect a company's reputation and street cred which, bottom line, affects their bottom line.
Quoted for factualness. We buy an expensive instrument and then they say the little magazine is costing them too much? I think it's this type of mindset (along with increased competition) that is and will continue to cost Taylor their customer base.
Just to point out that e-magazines aren't exactly green either (responding to the "bin" comment made about one of my earlier posts). It takes a lot of fossil fuel generated energy to create, store and distribute an online magazine and that's just a fact. At least my old W&S's went on to become something else made from paper. The e-version just continues to eat electricity whether I read it or not and long after anyone stops reading it altogether.
No they didn't. that paper isn't recyclable.
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Yikes Don.
First off, you're talking about this as though it's some grand conspiracy or personal affront to you. There is no "lie." Taylor will still provide a box (roughly 25ish copies) of first-of-year catalogs to dealers who want them. That's a print cost they're willing to incur for the dealers. Mailing them directly to what has to be millions of people is an outlandish request. Sure, they could take a survey and see if people are willing to pay but when it comes time to print copies you aren't footing the underlying cost of print plates, mock-ups, test runs, etc and there aren't enough people willing to pay to offset the cost of printing them.
In any business decision a company makes, there will be detractors, especially in a business largely attached to people resistant to any change about anything. People complain about 3-piece necks, the ES2, V-class bracing, urban-sourced woods, on and on. Y'all clearly don't remember what Taylor is about, which is constantly moving forward. They've always innovated and changed ahead of other brands, which is why we still have ebony fretboards, koa, mahogany, and other things. You have no idea what it really takes to make guitars. I sat at a table and listened to Bob Taylor talk about the political side of wood with CITES and all the things they have to do to keep track of everything and try to educate politicians around the world on wood so they don't ban all of a genus like they did with Indian rosewood a few years ago. Know why that got undone? Taylor. Between growing, harvesting, processing, shipping, and building there are literally thousands of people in steps in building guitars and it's daunting the more I learn. If you want to throw in the towel because they didn't consult you individually before cancelling print, that's fine dude. But you have no idea where that money they're saving goes. It's not corporate greed, it's keeping the company healthy so it survives.
"Gabriel has a vested interest (his job) in putting together a digital version no matter what. He has no interest or inclination to continue the printed version. To that end, he will do anything in his power to sink that ship. He is not only creating a new product, he is also founding his own fiefdom with his personal serfs. That's how corporate ladder stuff works." - this is just ridiculous mate. I don't have a "vested interest" in anything. There is no corporate ladder, I own my own company and don't work at Taylor. They're a client of my company, but so are other larger brands. I'm also just a big guitar nerd and longtime player who also spent nearly 20 years as a dealer and tech before I went into marketing full time. It has no affect on me at all if they stop printing W&S - they're gonna be my client either way, though I'm sure it does free up budget to do other things.
As I said, I was just in the PNW with Bob and others. These guys are putting all their time and resources into figuring out how to grow better wood in the future, grow it ethically, harvest it ethically, so in the next 25, 50, 100 years there will even be guitar wood. We're closer than you think to that being a problem and they won't be alive to see the results of what they're doing. They'll never know if it worked, but they're putting their money where their mouth is and trying and no one else in the entire industry is doing that. I'm proud to be a small part of telling the story through video.
In marketing, needs change. When I worked in a guitar shop they were spending $1500 a month on print Yellow Pages phone book advertising, which was insane. I convinced the owner to kill that by asking him a question and watching him Google it from his phone. I then built the store a new website and invested in SEO instead. Times change and even the big retailers no longer send huge print catalogs like they used to. I used to get weekly stuff from Sweetwater, Musician's Friend, etc but they stopped. I haven't stopped shopping.
As far as the environmental impact of digital content, it's far less than cutting down all the trees to make paper, which is affecting the availability of wood to make guitars with. I just got back from the Pacific Northwest and there's not an infinite supply of massive trees. Most of them are now gone and it's largely for lumber and paper. Toilet paper, paper towels, notebooks, magazines. So yeah you cling to print all you want, but remember that tree could have been a guitar instead.
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Hey Gabriel,
I get what you're saying about "needs changing" and all. You have your perspective, and that's always fine. But do not conflate the use of paper with
deforestation, or whatever other environmental issues. This is factually wrong. And maybe you didn't know that, and that's why I'm pointing it out here. Trees used for paper are farmed, not unlike the innumerable other things we consume: salmon, chickens, beef, and yes, trees for industrial and consumer use. No one is ravaging the pacific NW for paper trees, nor are any fewer guitars being made because of paper. Fast-growth trees, along with mills producing waste wood and sawdust are where paper comes from expressly for consumer use. No owls are displaced or redwoods chopped down for my magazine. And most certainly, technologies are constantly at work to stretch this use, if not replace it altogether, as is witnessed by the myriad synthetics commonplace today. And now that latter point is under criticism by the "environmental crowd," but that is a whole other conversation altogether.
So your perspective on digital format is yours --and many others these days, to be sure-- which makes plenty of sense in many arenas; this is undeniable. Others' perspectives can be just as valid, all without muddying the waters with environmental claims. So let's keep that clear is my simple point here. :)
Edward
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Actually Edward, trees from the PNW have been used for everything. Paper towels, toilet paper, building materials. Though some of it is farmed now that historically hasn't been at all true and the trees that are being harvested now aren't 300+ year-old trees because they're largely gone. The entire North American guitar industry only takes about 100 trees a year for tops. The rest is all for other industries - including paper. 85% of wood used in paper is softwood coniferous trees. Sitka, for instance, has been used a lot because they grow really large. Large trees are cut first and those are the ones you'd want for guitars. They are not farmed, they're from managed forests or plantation forests. Sitka for guitar tops also comes from managed forests in in the last 10 years there's been a dramatic drop in the size of trees available that are also usable for guitars. Yes companies are creating plantations and trying to work with governmental agencies but the damage has been done for quite a while. That's now that the industries have wised up under pressure, but the damage has largely been done. So no it's not "factually wrong." Almost half the wood fiber used for paper still comes from virgin forests.
A third of the wood we use still comes from wild forests too. There are other large drivers of deforestation, especially in places like Hawaii and outside the continental US where they just clearcut tons of land to create grazing room for cattle. Lots of wood is used in construction, furniture, and all kinds of other things. I'm not saying it all goes to paper, just that it's a really expensive resource to be using when something can exist digitally and be arguably better off for it.
No one said others' perspectives aren't valid. I'm saying that print is going away because it doesn't make sense anymore.
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I'm saying that print is going away because it doesn't make sense anymore.
With all due respect anyone who has been through a(n extended) power outage and/or tested the reading comprehension skills of a digital reader knows that's simply not the case.
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I'm saying that print is going away because it doesn't make sense anymore.
With all due respect anyone who has been through a(n extended) power outage and/or tested the reading comprehension skills of a digital reader knows that's simply not the case.
I mean, sure that makes it hard to read digitally, but no one is gonna die if they don't have access to digital Wood&Steel for a few days
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Taylor's confined distribution of this promotional 'magazine' to folks who registered a new Taylor at some time. No outreach in there to attract new customers. Eh? Are repeat sales all that common so as to ignore a wider potential customer base?
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Taylor's confined distribution of this promotional 'magazine' to folks who registered a new Taylor at some time. No outreach in there to attract new customers. Eh? Are repeat sales all that common so as to ignore a wider potential customer base?
That's just not true. I saw W&S in many a guitar shop (including GC) available for anyone who wanted to grab one. As a matter of fact that's how I came upon my first brush with Taylor guitars at all. In addition, it was my understanding that if you simply contacted Taylor they'd put you on the mailing list (though that might not be 100% accurate). To say that Taylor "confined distribution" or "ignored a wider potential customer base" via W&S in print format is just incorrect.
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I really miss the physical magazine.
That's why I buy real books, vinyl albums, CD's.
I want something tangible to hold and enjoy.
To hell with digital crap.
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I really miss the physical magazine.
That's why I buy real books, vinyl albums, CD's.
I want something tangible to hold and enjoy.
To hell with digital crap.
Ditto........old
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STOP right here. Take a breath.
OK.
Please go back and re-read this thread.
Now let's think this through.
There is only one 'issue' here. Would a print version of "Wood & Steel" be viable as a profitable printed product. I don't know, nor does anyone else. Since there will be a digital version, the question of continuing Wood & Steel is already a 'yes'.
My position is simply that I offered to pay for a printed version and used the "Fretboard Journal" as an example. It is a quarterly gloss magazine that covers material in the same field. I pay for a subscription to Fretboard Journal and have done so for years. So it can be done. And with a much thicker end product, I might add.
I have yet to see any kind of survey sent to current W&S customers. All I have seen are things as in the "It has been determined . . ." kind of thought process. Since the magazine has had a green light on a digital version, all questions and comments have been answered with obfuscations and mis-directions. Resulting in what is essentially "push-back" for talking about this while providing no real answers.
For example, why is it important to anyone what happens to the magazine by the end-user (subscriber) of said magazine. Yet this was a proffered topic used as some kind of answer or refutation. This is not relevant.
And it seems Gabriel accused me of taking this personally, while he himself is taking this personally, but using me as a straw-man to draw attention away from himself. There are many people in the news these days accusing someone else of doing the exact same thing that they themselves are 'guilty' of. Just to put blame on someone to divert suspicion away from themselves and onto someone else. For the record, my life will not end if W&S is only digital. That just makes it a reference tool, but definitely not something to read for enjoyment anymore. My only dog in this fight is that I enjoy reading printed matter rather than be tied to a computer screen. Something my older eyes don't like. And I will pay for this privilege.
An example of misdirection is the bit about not having power for a day or two, so it's no big deal. In actuality, not having power for any length of time IS a big deal. Both computer-wise and refrigeration-wise. Just because it might happen to a private citizen makes it OK? If a corporation goes without power it could be out of business, or at least lose business during that time. But they should have many redundancies and power reserves so that doesn't happen. I can't believe this passes for a creditable answer by trying to make someone feel bad and ashamed to complain if it happens (or possibly could) to them.
So here are some ideas.
Actually do a survey to find out what Taylor customers think about monetization of Wood & Steel in a print version. Please note that the customer base is a large part of the group of people that have in the past proven their trust in Taylor with their hard-earned cash. And took the time to register their guitars with Taylor.
Such a survey could include price gathering info of what might be acceptable levels. Maybe the magazine could be outright profitable. Or maybe find out a price point that would make it profitable if consideration is given to future repeat sales. You know, basic stuff.
Maybe try some sort of "Fund-me" page to conditionally gather funds toward a future product. Companies seem to try anything with this process. Then interested people could buy physical product on a pre-order basis, say for year or number of issues or whatever. Said money is in the form of pledges to pay if the product 'floats'. Money and peoples' interest could be measured up front. And if it doesn't float, so be it. The pledge is not collected, and thus does not cost anything.
There are other possible things, but most of this really concerns the company's interest in supporting their existing customer base in a manner to which they have been served in the past. Even if that means we have to provide some sort of financial help to Taylor.
And for the record, as far as reading things on-line when there is a printed copy available, I have become a total Luddite even though I have multiple degrees and certifications in the digital industry. I'm just a bit older and wiser now, and will try keep making sense of what is best for me. I very much enjoy reading books for both pleasure and knowledge. And I will acknowledge that I enjoy participating in forums, but that is not the same thing as settling in with a printed book or magazine. And I have taken a hiatus from digital platforms many times in the past. Good for the soul.
Be well,
Don
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Edited for proof-reading.